SoberNotMature - Episode 136 (Breeze Is Back - Industry Weasels & Other Wildlife)

00:00:01.37
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again to another episode of Sober, Not Mature. And I had two ideas on how to open this up. And I suppose if we were professional, Mike, I would have talked to you about this before we started.

00:00:15.75
Bill
But that's not what we do.

00:00:16.42
Mike
But clearly we're not.

00:00:19.33
Bill
So first way I was thinking about, you tell me, we'll pick two and see what you guys like, OK? So we're going to breeze through this episode like a hurricane, OK? Anyone?

00:00:28.95
Mike
Nope, that didn't work. Next.

00:00:31.49
Bill
Okay, ah the that simple, this episode is going to be a breeze.

00:00:35.81
Mike
That's a little better.

00:00:38.85
Bill
so So anyhow, sorry Breeze, that was that was that was a dad joke right off the fact.

00:00:40.30
Breeze 
We're not.

00:00:42.49
Bill
This is what happens when you agree to hang out with a couple of old guys on a Friday night.

00:00:46.49
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:00:48.69
Breeze 
I like it.

00:00:48.73
Bill
But anyhow, well good, and we and we appreciate having you back. And everyone, yes, we have Breeze again this this week. She was on with us back in episode 83, so a little while ago. But the first thing I want to say, and I want to thank you again openly to everyone, when people listen, and when you guys listen tonight, at the end of the episode, as soon as we say goodbye, just listen to the end, the little musical thing going on, this is the person that did that for us.

00:01:12.93
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:01:13.14
Bill
yeah And Mike, you call it what?

00:01:13.53
Breeze 
ah

00:01:16.28
Mike
the fuck off remix.

00:01:21.07
Bill
And it's the coolest thing in the world. And the way it came up, it was, we were closing out on the last episode. I don't know, somebody, one of us said, you know, I think you one of you guys said that, you know, it'd be great to to have that, you know, put some music behind it. and then Mike's like, okay, everyone, everyone be quiet. Shut up.

00:01:36.53
Mike
so

00:01:36.86
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:01:37.11
Bill
and then then he did it and then we got it to you and you did a really nice job. I listened to it. I listen to our episodes all the time, but I listen to that every single time because I love it. It's great. So once again, thank you.

00:01:48.60
Bill
We we truly appreciate it, but yeah.

00:01:49.83
Breeze 
oh no yeah of course

00:01:52.09
Bill
But you're, you're here for other reasons. So, um, again, you know, obviously we talked to you a while ago, but I know that you've been doing some different things and we'll get into all that, but I'll be honest with you. I didn't have a chance to.

00:02:03.29
Bill
Re-listen to that episode from what we had John before. So I don't remember how much we get into your story or not, but I guess worst case scenario, what do you think Mike, at least have her remind everyone who she is sobriety date, kind of a little bit of where she came from.

00:02:15.61
Bill
Sound good.

00:02:15.79
Breeze 
Oh no, no of course.

00:02:16.00
Mike
Remind me.

00:02:17.28
Breeze 
yeah i got I was like, wait, yeah, what did we talk about? I can't even remember.

00:02:23.60
Bill
Yeah, i don't I don't either, but you know just if you want, just go yeah go into a brief little thing, you know again, a little bit of your background and how you got to where you are, and then we can get into what you're doing and all that stuff.

00:02:23.86
Breeze 
Jeez.

00:02:31.49
Breeze 
Yeah. Oh, yeah.

00:02:34.53
Bill
I'm sure we got plenty of stuff to talk about, so.

00:02:36.45
Breeze 
Yeah, it's suddenly coming back to me because every time I'm probably said this last time, every time I get asked that question, it's like it my whole mind is like, um, wait, what's my name? Where am I from? What do I do?

00:02:52.44
Breeze 
Oh, so yeah, but my name is Breeze. I'm from Australia. um I am a musician and artist. i I'm now like dabbling in the music business, so I help artists with their career strategy and branding and kind of help them organize their life and what they want to do. And I kind of help them um achieve their goals and what their mission is.

00:03:17.45
Breeze 
um why they do music and how to monetize it, how to be a business person, all that sort of stuff, um which is a lot of fun. um And my sobriety date is May 22nd or 23rd. Oh, geez.

00:03:32.43
Mike
Come on now.

00:03:34.62
Breeze 
i know I know it's the...

00:03:35.18
Mike
That's the important one.

00:03:36.52
Bill
Yeah.

00:03:37.48
Breeze 
ah No, it's the 23rd in 2022. That's why I get them confused.

00:03:41.61
Bill
Nice.

00:03:42.51
Breeze 
Yep, there we go.

00:03:42.74
Mike
fifth

00:03:43.17
Bill
Oh, so the 2322 thing messes you up.

00:03:45.80
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:03:46.21
Bill
Okay. No, I get it.

00:03:46.66
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:03:47.05
Bill
I get it.

00:03:47.33
Breeze 
Yeah. There we go. Switches around. That's just like my brain and also the end of a long week on a Friday night.

00:03:55.61
Mike
You're not alone there.

00:03:55.64
Bill
yeah he Yeah, I was gonna say, you have so many times, well, every time, right, Mike?

00:03:57.07
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:03:59.86
Bill
We get on here and both of us have had, hey they you know, bad weeks or anything like that, but again, long weeks, you're working all week and then, you know, you gotta come on here and then kind of be on again, you know? And it's like, Jesus Christ, you know?

00:04:09.98
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:04:10.20
Bill
what do what what What do I have to do?

00:04:12.49
Breeze 
Right.

00:04:12.90
Bill
But yeah, we always feel better. This is kind of like a meeting for us, so we always feel better when we're done, but yeah, it's okay. Yeah, if your if your brain goes a little dead, you know, throughout here, it's normal. You're in the right crowd.

00:04:22.85
Breeze 
Yes. Yeah. Just like a warning to everybody listening. My brain is dead, so we're just powering through.

00:04:31.62
Bill
So, and i and I had texted you earlier, because I know we were talking about the timing and stuff like that.

00:04:35.68
Breeze 
who Yes.

00:04:35.88
Bill
And I knew I put Eastern, but I couldn't remember. You're still in Nashville, right?

00:04:40.12
Breeze 
i'm so I'm in Nashville. Yeah.

00:04:41.76
Bill
Okay.

00:04:42.05
Breeze 
So yeah, it's 707 right now.

00:04:44.58
Bill
Right. Yeah. same Same time.

00:04:45.18
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:04:45.74
Bill
And that's why I told her, I'm like, yeah, it's going to be central, whatever. Because the last thing in the world, I'm like, we always do Eastern just because it's easier. or Just put it in Eastern time. It doesn't matter where people are. Plus Mike, you know, I want to make Mike feel better.

00:04:56.72
Bill
You know, it's, he wants to, what he what he calls real time.

00:04:57.70
Mike
Well, it's real time. It is real time. What time is it in Manhattan? It's real fucking time. What time is it in DC?

00:05:05.57
Bill
Right.

00:05:06.51
Mike
It's real fucking time. Thank you.

00:05:08.01
Bill
Yeah. And that was, I was just going to ask him to explain it, but that's his, that's his explanation that, and you know, two of the biggest places in the country, obviously New York and DC, that's where the time is.

00:05:12.82
Breeze 
Yep.

00:05:17.01
Bill
So everything works from there. I'm fine with it.

00:05:18.75
Breeze 
Ew.

00:05:19.16
Bill
I'm fine with that. I don't have a problem with it. So, um, so you get, Oh God.

00:05:21.87
Breeze 
Well, in Australia, sorry, in Australia right now.

00:05:24.45
Mike
it It's tomorrow.

00:05:25.49
Breeze 
um It's, yeah, actually, yeah, tomorrow, 9.37am.

00:05:27.74
Mike
Yeah.

00:05:31.29
Mike
Right. I spent a couple of summers in Japan, so I mean kind of the same thing, right?

00:05:33.06
Breeze 
So, yep.

00:05:33.21
Bill
That's,

00:05:36.17
Breeze 
That's right, that's right. They're on the same time clock, which is wild.

00:05:38.95
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:05:39.80
Breeze 
That's crazy.

00:05:40.01
Mike
I know.

00:05:41.09
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:05:42.46
Bill
So a couple of quick questions with that.

00:05:42.49
Breeze 
Oh.

00:05:44.42
Bill
I know you said 22 when you got sober.

00:05:46.31
Breeze 
Mm-hmm.

00:05:46.58
Bill
So did you get sober here in the US s or in Australia or, okay, you did, okay.

00:05:49.63
Breeze 
I did. Yeah. Yeah.

00:05:52.05
Bill
And that's the part I couldn't remember, but um I guess as ah is a brief little thing, how long, when did you come come to the US and how, I'm just, I'm curious.

00:06:00.85
Breeze 
Hmm.

00:06:01.73
Bill
I've never, I don't think I've ever asked anyone how the drinking culture is in Australia. Do you see any differences there versus here or?

00:06:06.83
Mike
hey

00:06:07.66
Breeze 
Mike.

00:06:08.69
Mike
hey Dude, you spent enough time in Wisconsin, you know exactly what it is.

00:06:14.43
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:06:14.55
Bill
Well, you know, and and here's the here's the thing, I've listened to and talked to people who've been there, I guess really never gotten the conversation. I know certain certain areas are are this way, certain areas are that way.

00:06:24.80
Bill
You know, we as as alcoholics and addicts stand out more in different places. I just i just didn't know, so I'd just be curious, that's all.

00:06:29.92
Breeze 
Yeah. Well, i I guess when I let my family know I'm sober, I was met with like, what?

00:06:38.37
Mike
You're right.

00:06:38.61
Breeze 
So I don't know if that really explains anything.

00:06:40.89
Bill
Okay, yeah, it does.

00:06:41.12
Breeze 
um Yeah.

00:06:41.35
Mike
Mm hmm. It does.

00:06:43.84
Bill
So you're not you're not breathing air anymore?

00:06:44.01
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:06:45.60
Bill
What do you mean?

00:06:46.65
Breeze 
Yeah, like what what are you talking about drinking problem? Like yeah, so I think um it's definitely a very big or a heavy drinking culture.

00:06:50.64
Bill
yeah

00:06:56.23
Breeze 
I would say most people there are like high functioning alcoholics.

00:06:56.29
Mike
Right.

00:07:00.90
Breeze 
um But yeah, I think what helped me get sober, I did this nosedive into sobriety.

00:07:01.33
Mike
right

00:07:09.99
Breeze 
That's how I kind of explain it. Is because I moved over here three years ago and there was it was just like a lot of changes all at once and I was able to kind of Understand this a little bit more upon like reflection, you know, like how like hindsight's 2020

00:07:28.53
Bill
Right.

00:07:28.55
Breeze 
But just the like change of environment, not i mean the cultural changes aren't too much, but just enough. um There was like the visa status thing, like my visa was put on hold for a year, so I couldn't even work for that whole year that I was here.

00:07:46.57
Breeze 
So it was just like a lot of these stresses I had i brought over. a lot of baggage, you know, so you can't really ever run away from things like they follow you around.

00:07:56.73
Mike
Right.

00:07:57.81
Breeze 
um And yeah, yeah.

00:07:58.07
Mike
wherever you go, there you are.

00:07:59.52
Bill
yeah yeah we've we've heard we've heard that before

00:08:02.23
Breeze 
yeah and i think And I think like just the heat was turned up in terms of stress and um a lot of, I had this like a lot of pain and a lot of hurt.

00:08:12.50
Breeze 
So I think um I would say, um My drinking got worse because of that. I think it was able to sort of be this ah thing that I had in my life, but I didn't exactly know it was an unhealthy habit, if that makes sense.

00:08:27.14
Bill
Yeah, we've heard that before.

00:08:30.57
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:08:30.78
Bill
Okay, sure.

00:08:31.40
Breeze 
so so all that is yeah so All that had to happen was the timing, the enough stress, enough pressure.

00:08:32.29
Mike
Complete

00:08:38.60
Breeze 
um And then, you know, certain situations where I just didn't have um very good healthy coping skills. um So all of that just kind of put it in a nice situation to where it's like, now you have a drinking problem and now you're getting worse and now it's like...

00:09:01.28
Breeze 
You know how it is with alcohol, like it's it's really a very toxic poison and it just poisons everything. Like you give it enough time, it will literally ruin and destroy every life that is involved with you.

00:09:16.24
Breeze 
So I think for me,

00:09:17.05
Bill
Right.

00:09:18.40
Breeze 
um It was just yeah a nosedive into sobriety, which really fits my personality.

00:09:24.60
Mike
Mm

00:09:25.75
Breeze 
I'm very like all or nothing, so I think like there was no other way for me to do it.

00:09:28.58
Mike
hmm.

00:09:32.02
Breeze 
oh yeah so i think yeah I think I was here just over a year. and then um Yeah, then I got sober, um which it was so crazy because I was like, I find that as, I mean, I'm sure with anybody that experiences it is a very pivotal moment, but in so many more ways than we think. Like even now it's been over, I think I'm approaching like a two year, two and a half years. I think I've actually gone over the six month mark.

00:10:09.89
Breeze 
um that There's just so many other things I'm beginning to understand about myself that was like definitely hidden and is is you know coming out um because I'm able to either to allow that space to, one, learn a lot of healthy coping skills, but two, just really learn that I can manage my environments, um but number one thing is like I can manage myself a lot better.

00:10:40.11
Breeze 
and And kind of the curriculum that we all go through, I know everyone's journey is different, but in terms of the principles that we um come ah come across, like i'm I feel like I've arrived at that like no expectations lesson.

00:10:40.19
Mike
here

00:10:40.39
Bill
Right.

00:10:56.53
Mike
Mhm.

00:10:56.68
Breeze 
of which um Which I feel like it's it's a really wonderful experience in terms of it's not all at once, even though at the beginning it does feel very intense, um but arriving at the lesson of no expectations and just really learning to

00:11:08.17
Mike
Mhm. Mhm. Mhm.

00:11:15.71
Breeze 
Set high expectations but understanding I'm really the only one at the end of the day that I can control and not that it's like I didn't understand that but I feel like I'm um understanding that in more tangible ways in terms of it's easier to just let go of

00:11:23.60
Bill
Right.

00:11:27.23
Mike
Hmm.

00:11:34.28
Breeze 
the other other person, um whatever they're trying to do.

00:11:36.15
Mike
Right. Exactly.

00:11:36.97
Bill
Right.

00:11:37.83
Breeze 
Yeah, it's china it's kind of like easier for me to like kind of leave it there and being like, okay, I'm just gonna, I'm gonna leave you where you are, you know, even if it's a little bit on.

00:11:45.83
Mike
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I mean, and we, you know, we, for a very long time, we thought we actually could control other people.

00:11:47.86
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:11:53.28
Breeze 
Yes, yeah.

00:11:53.94
Mike
I know I did.

00:11:56.20
Bill
right

00:11:57.06
Breeze 
And it's so funny because all of this is so subtle. It's only when you actually just, ah you know, are sober-minded, like, you know, you can actually yeah you can actually have clarity and you can observe things and kind of allow space to think about things a little bit further than

00:12:00.74
Mike
Hmm. Right, exactly when you can actually think. Mm hmm.

00:12:15.62
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:12:15.68
Breeze 
Oh, I'm pissed off at that person or just very reactional things. Um, cause I think even good things can be reactional, you know, but just understanding that a little more deeply.

00:12:24.15
Bill
Right.

00:12:27.09
Breeze 
So I'm definitely, I wouldn't say enjoying the no expectations thing, but I'm definitely seeing a lot of value in, um, yeah.

00:12:34.36
Mike
Mm.

00:12:37.38
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:12:39.48
Breeze 
So.

00:12:39.72
Bill
Well it's, it's really hard and and we talk about that on here all the time you know there's the, the saying that says, you know, expectations are just resentments you know waiting to happen which um I get that but I mean a part of it's like okay, it's, it's, I don't want to say impossible, it's difficult not to have expectations but

00:12:49.75
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:12:55.36
Breeze 
Mhmm.

00:12:57.88
Bill
you have to have I think you just said it probably as clearly as it is can be that you are the only one you've got to understand that you're the only one that you can ah you know manage that expectation of yourself not necessarily anyone else so any one of us can go out into the world on a daily basis as we do

00:13:13.89
Breeze 
h

00:13:16.30
Bill
and say, oh, you know people are gonna drive you know nicely, right, Mike? People are not gonna be dickheads on the phone, right, Bill? Because I'm on the phone all day. um you know This isn't gonna happen to me at the grocery store.

00:13:26.83
Bill
This isn't gonna happen to me from a friend. But when it does, you wanna throw a big book at them and say, listen, read the first 164 pages. You're not a fucking alcoholic, but you might be able to learn something and then come back and treat me right.

00:13:40.04
Breeze 
Oh yeah.

00:13:41.18
Bill
you know

00:13:41.98
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:13:41.99
Bill
which again that's an expectation we can't expect well we we can't even expect that people you know that are in in the rooms or that are sober are going to act the way that we want you know um but like you said uh and you know it's not necessarily enjoying not having it i i agree with that in the cool part though is that we have and i know mike and ox i'm going to say it on here

00:13:42.96
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm.

00:13:49.78
Breeze 
Mm-hmm.

00:14:05.20
Bill
we've uncovered some things um that either one or both of us had no idea of whatever the thing might be and this has been over the two and a half years that we've been doing this and so you figure you know we were like 12-ish years sober when we started we're 14 and a half now and between that that 12 and that 14 years you know i've I've had these light bulb moments go holy shit

00:14:15.56
Breeze 
Mm

00:14:29.18
Bill
you know back then that's what this meant or mike brings that up and he's like do you remember this i'm like i don't have a fucking memory of that whatsoever you know i don't even i remember people saying that or he he reads something we do a reading usually every episode when it's just us and these are books we've been reading for you know 12 13 14 years and i'm like i don't even remember reading that this morning let alone what it said

00:14:35.21
Mike
Mmhmm.

00:14:36.38
Breeze 
-hmm Haha

00:14:52.25
Bill
five years ago, but it's so cool. And the main thing that we talk about is the fact that we need to be reminded every once in a while. Well, a lot of times around, they were like, well, we've talked about this before, but because all of us, I think, need to hear this stuff over and over again, right?

00:15:08.39
Breeze 
Oh, yeah, 100%. And i think that's I think it's just normalizing that. like I know um I have to be wary of it because i um I don't enjoy repeating myself, but there is sometimes a value in being able to repeat yourself or um read over things ah that you may already know instead of like just being like, ah, I already know that.

00:15:21.75
Mike
Mmhmm.

00:15:36.46
Breeze 
having that curiosity that you can still learn from something. And I think that's why you know reflection is good or um practicing patience if someone's like maybe not understanding what you're saying and you have to keep you know repeating yourself.

00:15:51.01
Bill
Right.

00:15:52.49
Breeze 
or and And I think it's just like, you know we weren't we weren't exactly taught this. girl I mean, at at least I wasn't taught all of this growing up, but there is an element of like whether you're

00:16:02.15
Mike
Right.

00:16:05.74
Breeze 
Um, sober or not sober, there is an element where you like arrive at some point in your life where you're like, okay, I have to be the one in charge now.

00:16:15.12
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:16:16.23
Breeze 
And I have to be the one who's responsible and and all of that.

00:16:16.29
Bill
Right.

00:16:16.30
Mike
Right.

00:16:19.28
Mike
Hmm.

00:16:19.38
Breeze 
So it's just kind of like, yeah.

00:16:22.84
Mike
Right. Oh, um i I go through it all the time now. It's like, wait, why am I the responsible one in this in this situation?

00:16:26.24
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:16:29.71
Mike
How how the fuck did this happen?

00:16:32.11
Breeze 
Oh yeah.

00:16:32.29
Mike
yeah You know, I mean, I've i've been irresponsible on my entire life.

00:16:33.62
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:16:37.37
Mike
How is why am I all of a sudden I, you know, I mean, my girlfriend says it to me all the time.

00:16:37.69
Breeze 
Yep.

00:16:41.53
Mike
No, you're the responsible one. You're the one that you you know I'm like, How the fuck did this happen? But in a way it's, it's kind of, it's kind of cool.

00:16:46.75
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:16:49.30
Mike
Cause I mean, all right, I guess I'm the grownup now. Um, I never wanted to be, but okay. I guess I am.

00:16:56.12
Breeze 
yeah yeah yeah And I think it's good to keep that you know like playfulness too.

00:17:02.03
Bill
Right.

00:17:03.37
Breeze 
Life has to be fun too. like it just can't be always Even when as I'm trying to be intentional with that, of like even if things are really hard, like I want to find something I can laugh at, even if it's like I force myself to laugh at a situation.

00:17:05.83
Mike
Oh yeah.

00:17:17.89
Breeze 
or You know, I think it's just like there's something in that that can be very like help with the healing But also kind of take the the blow off a little bit 100

00:17:27.93
Mike
Yeah.

00:17:28.59
Bill
Right. Yeah, I mean, absolutely. And like with the growing up thing, and it is, it's the, you know, being in a situation where, I don't know that we can be, we can now be available for people where we weren't, you know, for, for years.

00:17:34.28
Mike
Mm

00:17:41.03
Breeze 
%

00:17:42.64
Bill
And those are the, those are the things that are cool.

00:17:43.24
Mike
hmm.

00:17:45.86
Bill
And, and I've, I've mentioned this before, but I mean, getting, it's usually something that that's with my kids, all positive shit. You know, one of them will say, if I have adult children, um probably older than you, Breeze, while my son, I think my son might be younger than you, but

00:17:54.24
Breeze 
Mm hmm.

00:17:59.70
Bill
um My daughter will say something, just something like really nice, you know? And I'm like, God damn, you know? I mean, all I had to do was, you know, take a couple of steps and read some books and try to be a good human being. And this is what I get. Or, you know, my my son will call me and he needs something. Or ask somebody asks for advice. And the same thing as Mike says, I'm like, I have to sit there for a minute in in my head and I'm like, why the fuck are you asking me?

00:18:24.87
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:25.33
Bill
for advice.

00:18:25.53
Breeze 
hu

00:18:26.57
Bill
I mean really I don't I don't know my ass from a hole in the ground half the time to this day but you know somehow somebody's coming to me like Mike said okay I got guess I'm the grown-up now you know and and I'm not saying that people come to me for all this worldly advice but each one of us I think number one has has worth we've talked about that but on top of that Each one of us have these and these individual you know life lessons and life circumstances.

00:18:49.19
Breeze 
Ha ha ha.

00:18:52.27
Bill
There's a ton of things that Mike has done in his life that I haven't, that i that I've learned from. and you know like but Mike made a joke when I moved back to Wisconsin. I think you called me a couple of times, Mike, didn't you?

00:19:03.05
Bill
Because you couldn't figure out the something with the internet. And he's like, yeah, he goes, my my fucking computer guy moved away.

00:19:05.95
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:19:09.61
Bill
you know you know And I'm not saying that Mike is not illiterate when it comes to computers.

00:19:10.10
Mike
Yeah.

00:19:14.05
Bill
I just learn more about them for whatever reason. you know it it's it's ah It's a little bit of a skillset that I have. But when you really meet somebody who knows some shit about computers, it's kind of like when you when you meet somebody who's really got some some true deep down heartfelt wisdom about sobriety, you're like, holy shit, man, that's kind of cool.

00:19:27.94
Breeze 
Mm hmm.

00:19:32.05
Bill
you know But these are the people that you you know we can be, but we also have to look for others and learn from them, which is, it's ah it's a weird it's a weird thing, because I never used to look for either one. I didn't want and want to be the expert, I didn't want to be bothered, and I sure as hell didn't want to go ask somebody for help, ever.

00:19:44.26
Breeze 
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean, I'm i'm like an Italian. So it's like we were always right.

00:19:55.41
Breeze 
And we have an opinion about everything. So I had to almost like unlearn that.

00:19:57.81
Mike
Mm-hmm. Oh, yeah.

00:20:01.82
Bill
we've We've got a couple of Italian friends, right, Mike?

00:20:03.79
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:20:04.91
Bill
Yeah, Frankie.

00:20:06.29
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:20:07.21
Bill
Where's Frankie? when Where's Frankie when you need him? He's one of our one of our buddies in Ohio.

00:20:09.01
Mike
Right.

00:20:10.60
Bill
He's a good dude.

00:20:10.89
Breeze 
Yeah. and And then they'll they'll always like be like, yeah, but what do I know at the end?

00:20:11.71
Bill
um

00:20:15.13
Breeze 
Like a disclaimer, just in case you you do take on the advice and it's terrible.

00:20:16.71
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah, right.

00:20:20.87
Bill
Yeah, yeah to do all these things, but yeah, what do I know?

00:20:20.98
Breeze 
Yeah, but I don't know nothing. So yeah, do whatever you want.

00:20:27.15
Bill
So yeah, if somebody fucks up fucks up their life, is that your fault, right?

00:20:27.58
Breeze 
Yeah. Exactly.

00:20:31.83
Bill
So when when you came to when you came to the United States, did you have family here or do you have family here or you just came over figure and figured I want to do this thing or what?

00:20:41.08
Breeze 
um I have a... I don't even know what the... It's my grandpa's brother, so I'm not sure like what you call...

00:20:49.75
Mike
Great, uncle.

00:20:50.62
Breeze 
Yeah, a great uncle, um which I've met once, um but I have like a lot of family history here, so on my mom's side, her mom was born in Pennsylvania, and her...

00:20:51.95
Mike
Yeah.

00:21:02.94
Mike
ah

00:21:02.97
Bill
Okay.

00:21:03.91
Breeze 
Her parents actually immigrated from Hungary um and then my grandpa, he was born in Rome and then moved to England and then moved to America and then that's then met my mom's mom and then they lived here for...

00:21:20.97
Breeze 
probably like 35 years or something like that. And all my uncles were born in New York, and but my mum was born in Melbourne, Australia.

00:21:26.88
Bill
Okay.

00:21:28.27
Mike
Hmm.

00:21:30.60
Breeze 
And she was like, but I'm fairly so i'm fairly certain I was conceived in New York 100%.

00:21:34.75
Mike
Hehehehe.

00:21:35.00
Breeze 
Like I've done the math. So yeah, so my mom's a dual citizen um and I e think we would have had to live here for like seven years or something like that for you know me so I could go for citizenship.

00:21:50.89
Breeze 
I don't know, it's it's really interesting.

00:21:50.92
Bill
Right.

00:21:52.83
Breeze 
It's just kind of like... Why wouldn't you just allow someone to apply? Because it wasn't like my grandparents were like here for five years and then just you know left. is like they They literally like had a life here, raised a family here.

00:22:02.59
Mike
Right.

00:22:07.57
Breeze 
um and so whereas like It's funny because then on the Italian side, it's like as long as someone in your family has a citizenship, you can just go get your citizenship. like It's like that easy.

00:22:20.08
Breeze 
So yeah, all that to say, it would have been so helpful if we did live here for like five years when I was younger, so I can be like, I could have applied for citizenship, but it's all good.

00:22:31.68
Breeze 
There's a process for everything. um So yeah, I have like a lot of family history here um and also,

00:22:35.05
Bill
Right.

00:22:42.23
Breeze 
it's just There's a lot more to do here than Australia in terms of like music the music industry and the entertainment industry. um it's not as like i mean It's gatekeeping, but not as much.

00:22:54.70
Breeze 
like There's enough to where you can be like a blue-collar musician and live quite comfortably.

00:22:54.84
Mike
Right.

00:23:00.89
Breeze 
You don't have to like shoot for the stars to be able to eat.

00:23:04.25
Mike
right

00:23:05.07
Breeze 
so um That was what was, ah I think, I also never really felt like Australia was my home. it was really and like It was really weird. I never felt like grounded there, but I remember we we went to California. I was like 13 or something like that. And I remember feeling like really grounded and it was just like a very interesting feeling. and i think in my mind, i'm like, I'm going to move here one day.

00:23:36.65
Breeze 
I think I just knew that, like, it's like I felt more at home, even like coming to Nashville, which um wasn't ever really on my radar. It was just kind of like an opportunity presented itself.

00:23:48.17
Breeze 
And I was like, yeah, like, let's do it. um Just even being in a city I'd never seen before or only heard of, like, I felt more at home.

00:23:56.16
Mike
Hmm. Mm hmm.

00:23:57.57
Breeze 
um So I think, yeah, it's just interesting. I think sometimes, like, where you're born isn't exactly your home. I think it's, we're meant to be, I mean, my whole family is just like, they're pioneers.

00:24:07.08
Bill
Right.

00:24:10.40
Breeze 
Like we're we're always like moving around and build, like building things and then moving off to the next thing. And like, um, so I think it's just also in my blood to go somewhere unknown and build something, create something and then move on to the next.

00:24:27.68
Breeze 
So yeah.

00:24:28.92
Bill
I mean, that's, that's kind of cool. So when you, when you came out here though, you had a, you were in a band or found a band when you came to the Nashville or how did that part happen?

00:24:35.55
Breeze 
no so yeah i'd I've been touring since I was like 12 years old, um just yeah in that um world of like write a bunch of songs, release them, go tour them.

00:24:41.65
Bill
Okay.

00:24:50.75
Breeze 
Once you finish the circuit, get back in the studio, release. like I was just in that world. um and so The group I was in with my brother, Firebird, Weedbean,

00:25:04.23
Breeze 
um Probably about five or six years by the time we moved to Nashville. And like we were already we already had plans the whole time. like We're going to come to the States and just keep keep doing it. And I think what interrupted that was I sobered up.

00:25:23.28
Mike
Uh huh.

00:25:23.37
Breeze 
And then, and you know like it was I can kind of lead all the roads to sobering up. is where i just i think It's not that I like lost passion for it, I think I just just so much about me changed. like i just I don't know how else to explain it. like I think I started realizing there was so much more to me, and you know when when I was presented the opportunity to like kind of go on a hiatus and I was I had that opportunity of like I could easily go drum for other people it wasn't like there was a shortage of people that were like as soon as they were like oh you're not you know doing firebird full-time like come drum for me like that was like I had a lot of opportunity but I just didn't feel like drawn to it and I think

00:26:09.40
Bill
Right.

00:26:13.26
Breeze 
I just allowed myself to kind of be like, well, what else can I do? I've been doing this since I was 12, like, I'm 32 now. So it's like, that's a very long time of just doing the same thing. um And then that's how I kind of started understanding this.

00:26:35.70
Breeze 
so much more to me than just that and and it was almost like it was a turnoff to think about drumming and writing music and it was really weird I just kind of had this like I pulled way back from it to where it's like um someone asked me to go on tour with them and I was so conflicted because I was like you know it's good money and I'm turning down the pay but I just really don't feel like I should do it and I remember telling them I can't do it you know I won't be able to give my best and I remember just like getting off that phone call and just

00:27:18.50
Breeze 
crying my eyes out like it was just so weird like I was just like what is happening to me it's like you know it's like ah it was it was like PMS but like on steroids I was like what the heck is this like I this feeling was so weird and I think I understand it now is just you know an acceptance, right, of like an era is kind of was closing up and I was grieving, you know, a part of me that I'll always appreciate and it's not like...

00:27:48.80
Breeze 
it It was bad or wrong. or It's just like at this very present moment where I am at now, that's not what I focus on. and um I'm in a much better headspace now to where it's like I can understand it so much more, but going through it, it was just like I was feeling so knocked around. like i It felt like I was getting sober again.

00:28:11.49
Breeze 
like That's what it felt like.

00:28:11.58
Mike
Hehehehe.

00:28:14.13
Breeze 
I was like, oh my gosh. i But what I'm doing now just makes so much sense. like it just everything or Everything about my personality, the way my brain works, the just everything about me makes so much sense in what I'm doing now.

00:28:30.92
Breeze 
and i I was feeling like towards the end of having that, labeling myself as an artist, I was feeling like quite um restricted. And um it actually wasn't until recently where I could finally articulate that and being like, you know, it actually feels like whenever someone says, you know, you should be a drummer, like, why aren't you doing that? Like, that doesn't make any sense. Like,

00:28:58.28
Mike
Hmm.

00:28:58.46
Breeze 
i I feel like they're telling me like go back in the cage. That's what it feels like.

00:29:02.76
Mike
Right.

00:29:04.06
Bill
but Right.

00:29:04.87
Breeze 
Yeah. And I remember like unpacking it with my brother and he was like, why don't you want to sit behind the kit? And I'm like, I just don't think I'm meant to be doing that now.

00:29:14.44
Mike
Right.

00:29:14.52
Bill
Right.

00:29:14.56
Breeze 
And he's like, that's okay. I'm like, thanks. Like, yeah, it is okay. So yeah, fuck anyone that keeps asking me to fucking draw him.

00:29:21.64
Mike
Hehehehehehehe.

00:29:23.10
Breeze 
Like stop asking me, you know?

00:29:25.37
Bill
Well, you know, you know that the the thing of it is that we joke about it all the time about, you know, what will we do when we get sober or, you know, when when people say, what am I going to do when I get sober? And the answer is whatever the fuck you want to do, you know.

00:29:36.81
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:29:37.45
Bill
And I think that, um well, I don't even think I know for a fact that it the The person I was prior to to getting sober, um i mean i when I kind of look back at it, I can see glimpses of of that person and understand and you know' kind of be able to pull back and say, okay, I can see me in there.

00:29:44.45
Breeze 
Mm-hmm.

00:29:56.85
Bill
But it's such a small part. you know um Maybe my personality is the same. Maybe I have the same smart-assness and humor or whatever it is.

00:30:02.82
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:30:03.58
Bill
but um I don't act or react the same way.

00:30:05.84
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:30:06.84
Bill
I don't have the same wants or needs. um I can get by unless I can appreciate more. And I do appreciate more, you know? But the other thing too is that, you know, to like what you said is, you know, having, just having that feeling of this, this is not, I don't know why, but this is not what I want to do or need to do right now.

00:30:26.59
Bill
And and that's a cool thing because I've had that happen, and we talked about it on here, it's like trying to force things, you know?

00:30:33.18
Breeze 
yeah

00:30:33.44
Bill
whatever it is down to the first story I've ever told about it was trying to buy a new cell phone versus you know do I want to be in this relationship do I want to make this decision decision about this whatever the thing is big or small you know we get this um I don't know this feeling which is which is unexplainable but something inside of us now that opened up you know with with this whole sobriety thing I believe that allows us to have a lot of feelings but allows us to have this I don't want to say six cents.

00:31:01.13
Bill
I don't know if that's the right way to put it, but that's the only way I could explain it. this This extra additive that says, okay, this doesn't feel right. I don't know why, but I'm going to go right. I feel like going left or til everyone's telling me to go left, but I feel like going right and I'm going to do it.

00:31:16.15
Bill
Whatever the fuck happens, I'm doing that.

00:31:16.24
Breeze 
Yeah. And it makes the least sense. like And it's not logical, you know? And and i think I think this is why I was like...

00:31:24.61
Bill
Right.

00:31:28.97
Breeze 
um Oh, I'm the no expectations lesson. I think I had a lot of these expectations of you've been doing this your whole life.

00:31:41.03
Breeze 
Like if you stop doing it, like does that mean it's kind of like I had this expectation. I had to do this till the end of time. And, you know, and it was something that it was like, yeah, I was so all in on it.

00:31:50.01
Bill
Right.

00:31:54.15
Breeze 
Like I dedicate a lot of my life and my childhood to. touring and being a musician and doing the damn thing, you know? And did it now seem like that was all wasteful?

00:32:06.79
Breeze 
But i I didn't... I think I felt so strong about it that I... whenever that comment did come up, I just shut it down straight away being like, no, actually I can understand an artist ah in a way that no one else can unless they've said they've toured for 20 years being an artist.

00:32:27.92
Breeze 
You know, like those are skills that aren't just, you know,

00:32:28.04
Mike
Mmhmm.

00:32:28.86
Bill
Right.

00:32:32.42
Breeze 
You can't just like go to college for two years and pick up those skills. like These are like specialized things that only take time. and so It's just understanding that, and that in a weird way allowed me to be a lot more confident and a lot more um accepting of like these parts of myself that I think for a long time I was like battling with. like you know that I'm a very, like like I said, all in or all out kind of person and you know, it's and what I'm doing now makes so much sense.

00:33:01.85
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:33:06.33
Breeze 
It's just I'm learning it, how to do it in, I guess, healthy ways, you know?

00:33:12.17
Mike
Right. Oh, it's very much like being an alcoholic, you know, right.

00:33:12.90
Bill
Right.

00:33:13.54
Breeze 
Yeah. Yeah. I knew that I knew that would be a good skill.

00:33:16.80
Mike
It's yeah. yeah Absolutely. Right. and And now we take it and we use it and we help other people to, you know, not be active alcoholics, but how to be sober alcoholics.

00:33:29.26
Mike
Yes.

00:33:29.38
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:33:30.17
Mike
Yeah. you know So all that stuff we did, again, we we talk about all the time on here.

00:33:31.97
Breeze 
Yep.

00:33:34.35
Mike
It's all that stuff that we did in the past that maybe we think, you know, oh, that was a waste of time or whatever. It wasn't even if if we're not applying it in our lives now.

00:33:41.04
Breeze 
no

00:33:43.42
Mike
where We have those skills that we we got for whatever, you know, hustling on the street, that that work ethic of being a drug addict. You know, that was fucking hard work, man. And I hustled my ass all the time.

00:33:55.07
Mike
You know, and I transfer that over to my job now just in healthy ways.

00:33:58.72
Breeze 
yeah

00:34:00.06
Mike
Exactly.

00:34:00.24
Breeze 
hu

00:34:00.78
Mike
That's just what you're talking about.

00:34:02.80
Breeze 
Yeah, i I think about that with, um because Nashville has a lot of that going on. And and I'm like, man, it's sad to see, but it's also like, man, the fucking dedication these people have.

00:34:09.72
Mike
Sure.

00:34:16.07
Mike
yeah

00:34:16.31
Breeze 
like you know They are dedicated and they have no fear of rejection either, which is like, that is a really great skill to have.

00:34:20.57
Mike
Right. right

00:34:26.41
Breeze 
you know

00:34:26.59
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:34:26.93
Breeze 
um

00:34:27.33
Bill
Right.

00:34:28.06
Breeze 
But yeah, I even think about like, you know, the the people in the music industry that are just terrible people and they're greedy. And it's like, you know, if you actually just put that energy to actually wanting to see people win, like you could still end up with the same result.

00:34:45.38
Breeze 
That's just like, you know, but you're just in your own way.

00:34:45.98
Mike
Right. Mm hmm.

00:34:49.79
Breeze 
um Which is, yeah, they're prerogative. That's their thing.

00:34:54.90
Mike
Absolutely. ah Back to the acceptance and can't control anybody but yourself.

00:34:56.83
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:34:59.02
Mike
Right.

00:34:59.16
Breeze 
Exactly. It doesn't mean I can't flick him the finger every now and then.

00:35:02.30
Mike
Oh, absolutely. I've got two of them. I use them all the time.

00:35:04.93
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:35:06.44
Bill
yeah so from So real quick, and i obviously I'm very interested. I think we both are if here and you know all the stuff that you're that you're up to now. And you know I mean, we follow you on Instagram.

00:35:16.89
Bill
I'm on Instagram. you know Obviously Mike is not really on there all that much, if any, anymore, right Mike? But um but so I have a rough idea, so we'll talk about it.

00:35:21.74
Mike
Nope.

00:35:25.15
Bill
But the question I had, and you know so, Two and a half years in, what is, I'm sure you have a ah some sort of a daily routine for your, and I ask people this all the time, because I'm curious, you know, of different people, different age groups, different backgrounds, lifestyles, whatever the case is, I'm always curious to see what people's, what's your day-to-day, and i'm not you don't have to get really detailed, but from when you get up to when you go to bed, what do you do outside of all the other stuff for your sobriety, or how do you how do you handle that or structure your day?

00:35:56.97
Breeze 
Oh, for my for my sobriety?

00:35:59.88
Bill
Correct.

00:36:00.04
Breeze 
or yeah um I pray a lot. I think it's like I i um try and, like, when I pray it's mainly just, you know, a conversation.

00:36:12.91
Breeze 
So if I'm ever feeling a certain type of way, i i try and get I get in the habit of just surrendering the emotion and the feeling of it.

00:36:24.27
Breeze 
And I find that that that is very helpful because I think it's the reaction that was getting me into trouble, you know, it was the follow through.

00:36:32.00
Bill
Right?

00:36:34.00
Breeze 
So i I immediately surrender whatever I'm feeling and whether it's, you know, shame or anger or frustration or, um you know, anything that can move me to a place of um not exactly acting in my own best interests, and and I would say in an act of fear, um because that's kind of what it is really at its core.

00:37:04.57
Bill
Right.

00:37:06.08
Breeze 
um And I think it's been it's been really good because i I get to ask the questions of like, what does love look like in this situation? Because I think love has its transforms in many different ways, right? I think it shows up in, depending on the situation, it shows up in um very different ways.

00:37:31.29
Breeze 
So I try and look for that, you know, especially when it's ah in in situations where it may be hard to act in love because I feel like that's where I kind of um I found has been really beneficial to where I I don't get tempted as much, I don't feel stressed as much, i all those kind of triggers that are almost non-existent, but it it just helps me um deal with the day-to-day things, especially, you know, um like i've like today I've been going since like

00:38:14.35
Breeze 
7.30 this morning. as nearly It's like 7.40 now. So it's just like, where is there a time to take a break?

00:38:18.67
Bill
yeah

00:38:20.97
Breeze 
Not many times. Like that's just kind of what life is now. So it's very seasonal. Um, but I try and be very intentional with even when I'm busy or even when I'm who I'm around a lot or what I watch or even what I listen to.

00:38:39.95
Breeze 
Like I've just been very mindful of those things of just. filling my mind and and everything I am in my day-to-day with a lot more joy and fun and love. And I think that's been helpful in... I i try and tell myself it's funny because I i did get in a bit frustrated at this one particular situation. And I remember God's like, don't sweat the small stuff. And I was like,

00:39:11.22
Breeze 
Okay, and so now I tell myself that, like, don't sweat the small stuff. But then the kid, the child, like, two-year-old in me is like, what's the small stuff? Like, I want to know, like, so what's small and what's like a big deal?

00:39:24.58
Breeze 
You know what I mean? And most things aren't a big deal.

00:39:25.94
Bill
Right.

00:39:27.37
Breeze 
We just kind of like... make them these big things. um So it's it's just kind of like understanding where I need to place things and I think um that's what's been really helpful to me.

00:39:32.89
Bill
Right.

00:39:44.10
Breeze 
um And also just being around people that um are also building things and are wanting to be successful in things and have the same mindsets and the same work ethics. I find that that's very helpful because I think it keeps me in the space of Focusing on the right things, you know, and I think now to working with a lot of different artists, I'm not thinking about myself a lot. I'm thinking about them and really listening to them and listening to what they're wanting to achieve and even like their own limiting belief. It's really interesting because I was like,

00:40:26.27
Breeze 
a lot of I think, Mike, you touched on it anyway. um A lot of the skills that we learn are very transferable in any situation, so it's um it's not like we're doing AA meetings, but it almost could be sometimes.

00:40:33.07
Mike
Mhm.

00:40:36.44
Bill
Oh, yeah.

00:40:43.52
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:40:44.18
Breeze 
um

00:40:44.30
Bill
Right.

00:40:44.32
Mike
Yeah. Well, practicing these principles in all of our affairs.

00:40:47.14
Breeze 
Yeah, and and just like how quickly how quickly a conversation can get vulnerable, too.

00:40:52.86
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:40:56.37
Breeze 
We're just meeting up to talk strategy, and suddenly it's like this like vulnerable conversation where I'm like oh this is like, I find so much joy in that because I think...

00:41:00.02
Mike
Right.

00:41:07.39
Breeze 
i think I found a lot more purpose in what I'm doing now, so that really helps along with all those um other things I said.

00:41:12.67
Mike
Yeah.

00:41:18.10
Breeze 
So yeah, that's kind of my my day today.

00:41:18.68
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:41:20.42
Bill
and And we were just talking about it that was that last week Mike about helping other people that we were talking about

00:41:23.22
Mike
Oh, yeah.

00:41:26.85
Breeze 
Yeah, yeah.

00:41:27.28
Mike
Yeah, right. I mean, that's yeah it's again a bath, man. It doesn't fucking add up. I was making other people's lives better. Make my life better. that That doesn't work.

00:41:37.20
Breeze 
Yeah, and I, yeah.

00:41:37.48
Mike
But but it does. It works every time. It doesn't make any damn sense, but it works every time.

00:41:43.20
Breeze 
yeah I think because it's just i think we to have um we have to have and

00:41:52.75
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:41:53.45
Breeze 
and The first session that I have with an artist, is you know a lot of it is like we have to build the foundation of everything. So a lot of it is like we ask the existential questions. like

00:42:06.72
Mike
and Right.

00:42:07.25
Breeze 
Why are you doing this? and you know And in that, it's like, okay, if you were to zoom out and have this vision of your why,

00:42:19.16
Breeze 
and in your mind's eye, you're kind of being like, this is why I'm doing it. And it's always something like that's far in the future. And is that something when you're thinking about it, is that something that can still work effectively and efficiently, even long after you're not here.

00:42:39.66
Breeze 
So it's like building things now that are outside of yourself that still have this impact.

00:42:39.82
Mike
Right.

00:42:45.71
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:42:46.56
Breeze 
And it's just something in that that like, helps you actually discover more about who you are. And I think that's why we need that purpose because everything gets placed where it needs to be placed, if that makes sense.

00:43:03.62
Breeze 
like we The validation gets placed where it should be.

00:43:04.67
Bill
Right.

00:43:08.31
Breeze 
um We have more compassion for people and we have a more grace for things like just every element of who we are like what makes up a person and we're very complex but like every kind of layer gets placed where it should be and I think purpose is that ah very like driving force and like intention is a very overused word but all it really means is you're just taking a second to think about

00:43:30.00
Mike
Hmm.

00:43:35.24
Breeze 
Why am I about to do this thing?

00:43:39.45
Mike
thing that I'm about to do.

00:43:41.04
Breeze 
Yeah, and it and it could be so it could be so small as like, I'm gonna watch my words, or or it could be a big move, you know?

00:43:41.13
Mike
Right.

00:43:46.91
Mike
Right.

00:43:49.87
Breeze 
Like, should I move country?

00:43:50.57
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:43:53.54
Breeze 
Like, why am I, what's my intention for that? What do I intend to do?

00:43:56.92
Mike
Right.

00:43:57.37
Breeze 
And I think like, I think just learning that as a habit is a game changer for life like anyway. But it also, like it does double back to what you know what we learn.

00:44:10.39
Breeze 
What helps us stay sober is that accountability and that transparency.

00:44:13.91
Mike
Absolutely.

00:44:14.04
Breeze 
like those you know if If you're not um ah holding yourself accountable or are being transparent, it's kind of like you're just going to fall back into old habits.

00:44:24.65
Mike
Mm.

00:44:24.74
Breeze 
you know

00:44:25.46
Mike
Absolutely. Right.

00:44:26.49
Breeze 
yeah

00:44:26.92
Mike
Yeah. You know, if you're if your intentions are pure, then, yeah, the the work's going to come out right. And that's yeah.

00:44:32.79
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:44:33.66
Mike
Right. But you're trying to hide things and be shady and cut corners. And yeah, that shit never works.

00:44:39.10
Breeze 
Yeah. And yeah. And it's, I think.

00:44:42.34
Mike
You get a shoddy product.

00:44:44.14
Breeze 
Yeah. And I think too, it's funny, like the comparisons, I think why we, you know, why we, you know, are led down these paths is because we don't want to spend time to think about things.

00:44:59.88
Breeze 
We just want things instantly. Like, I don't want to feel this pain. Like, I don't want to, I don't want to think about this or I just need to escape or I just want the end result.

00:45:04.15
Mike
Right. Mm hmm.

00:45:10.72
Breeze 
And I think.

00:45:10.99
Mike
Yeah, absolutely. I want the end result and I don't want to put any work into it.

00:45:14.43
Breeze 
Yeah, exactly.

00:45:15.23
Bill
Imagine that.

00:45:16.72
Breeze 
Yeah. And it's just like, that's not reality. Like it, I mean, it, you can make it your reality, but you're not going to be as effective.

00:45:24.36
Mike
I have made it my reality.

00:45:26.87
Breeze 
Exactly.

00:45:27.49
Mike
It didn't work out very well.

00:45:27.93
Breeze 
And it. Exactly. So it's just kind of like, take it from us. It's like, you know, you, you can listen to us or you can just, you know, but I mean that, that too, it's like everyone Everyone's journey to whatever they need to discover or whatever however they need to you know whatever they need to figure out, they're going to learn it at their own pace.

00:45:51.12
Breeze 
and i think

00:45:51.49
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:45:52.54
Breeze 
i think that's um I respect people that are sober in terms of

00:45:59.99
Mike
Hmm.

00:46:01.24
Breeze 
knowing what you know and what you do daily, and you may not talk about it all the time, or everyone has different ways of doing it, but even a lot of the like battles that you face, a lot of the checking in that you do, um i I think it's it's hard to day it's almost harder to stay humble or have compassion for people.

00:46:25.42
Mike
Hmm.

00:46:27.87
Breeze 
Because it's kind of like, I can see how you could get easily overwhelmed and frustrated by people that are like, maybe not addicts, but are just like, like assholes.

00:46:27.88
Mike
Hmm.

00:46:37.73
Mike
Assholes.

00:46:38.87
Breeze 
Yeah, like they're just kind of, yeah, they're just like a bunch of dickheads or like, so it's like, what's your fucking excuse?

00:46:38.99
Mike
yeah Right in that.

00:46:44.10
Bill
Right.

00:46:44.40
Mike
ill Right.

00:46:45.20
Breeze 
But I think that's their addiction, right? It's like everyone has, everyone has to sober up from something, whether it's and the a substance or whatever it is.

00:46:48.31
Mike
um Yeah.

00:46:52.68
Mike
Yeah.

00:46:55.92
Mike
Exactly.

00:46:55.95
Breeze 
um

00:46:56.40
Mike
And and that all comes back down to what we started with, you know, trying to control other people and accepting things as they are and realizing that the only thing we can control is ourselves and our reactions to it.

00:47:06.04
Breeze 
Exactly. Uh-huh. Yes.

00:47:09.65
Bill
But you know what? And actually, let's ah let's take a quick break right now, because we we obviously want to get into you know what you're doing now, a little bit more detail, um obviously, Breeze, about what you're doing now.

00:47:12.75
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:47:19.14
Bill
But what do you think, Mike? Time for a quick one.

00:47:21.47
Mike
Absolutely. Well, stay tuned for more of this wonderful conversation right after these words from our sponsors.

00:47:36.89
Bill
All right, everyone, welcome back. And yeah, so um all the things that you've been leading up to, and I seriously, it's like, I didn't want to interrupt because I'm i'm just taking all these things in and it's it's so, well, what's what's kind of funny to me, and I don't mean funny in like a ha ha type of way, but but what we've talked about a couple of times already is what you're talking about so far from what it sounds like, and we're gonna hear more here in a second, but what you're doing in your work mirrors what we and I say quote unquote we do in sobriety which is so cool because I mean Mike and I talk about this all the time you know again practicing these principles in all our affairs Mike said that a minute ago or a few minutes ago and you know being able to like you said having these vulnerable conversations with people

00:48:24.25
Bill
And even though you're not in a meeting, I recognize that quite a bit with conversations. If I'm in a deep conversation with somebody, I have to step back a bit and say, okay, sometimes I realize that i I'm like, I got some skills here that I need to use, or I need to um calm down, or I need to back off, or I need to practice, literally practice these things I've learned.

00:48:43.56
Bill
But I mean, man, the this whole sobriety thing that we go through, we all do all this work for, especially early on, um that ends up having you know just these, it's it translates into everything, makes life so much easier, right?

00:48:56.16
Breeze 
Yeah.

00:48:59.11
Breeze 
I wouldn't say easier, I think, because it isn't.

00:49:03.75
Bill
Yeah.

00:49:04.01
Breeze 
It's almost like the more you know that saying ignorance is bliss. I think there is a part of when I was wrapped up in my bullshit that I could use that excuse.

00:49:08.76
Bill
Well, that's a good point.

00:49:09.09
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:49:18.89
Breeze 
I was doing the best with what I knew, whereas now it's like I know better.

00:49:22.64
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:49:24.33
Breeze 
It's almost worse.

00:49:26.13
Bill
Damn it, i yeah, it is. you know it is There's a there's a there's a a spotlight on us and we we talk about that too. you know it's the you know Just because we we may be the only vision of a sober person that somebody sees.

00:49:38.02
Bill
So inside i mean outside of the rooms or outside of a meeting or outside of a sober gathering is probably more important than inside the rooms, right Mike? It's easier to act, why do you say that?

00:49:49.33
Bill
Act good between this and that, but then it's between whatever, yeah.

00:49:51.08
Mike
No, yeah, right it's it's yeah, it's not what you do between the ah the ah sobriety ah That's variety. Jesus Christ.

00:50:00.49
Bill
Serenity.

00:50:01.14
Mike
Thank you. It's been a long day for me, too ah It's not what you do between the serenity prayer and the our father it's what you do between the our father and serenity prayer Yeah, right

00:50:13.66
Bill
Yeah, that's what you do out there and in life all the time.

00:50:15.86
Mike
Yeah, that hour in the church basement is fucking easy. Yeah, it's the rest of the time.

00:50:19.66
Breeze 
Oh, yeah, because you're with you're with like minded people where you're like they're sometimes like worse than you.

00:50:22.78
Mike
Yeah, exactly.

00:50:26.22
Breeze 
So you feel a little better.

00:50:26.87
Mike
yeah

00:50:29.60
Breeze 
Like, ah at least I didn't do that, sir.

00:50:29.68
Bill
So...

00:50:32.60
Mike
Now they'd be careful, no comparing. That's dangerous shit there.

00:50:36.35
Breeze 
i know

00:50:36.99
Bill
Yeah, ah exactly. But so um obviously we, so we know you got away from the actual band thing and the touring thing and the, and the drumming part of it. So you're actually helping artists.

00:50:48.49
Bill
So you're doing actually, and I know you've got, ah is it a podcast that' itself or YouTube or a combination of both, or I guess just tell us exactly what you're, what you're involved in now and you know, what you're, what you're doing for people.

00:50:58.06
Breeze 
I Yeah, so it's an artist development company. I guess that's what would kind of be tied under.

00:51:08.68
Breeze 
So artist development, it was kind of like, it's it feels like this very um underrated department that labels used to have. And basically it's like when they would would sign an artist, they would then develop them and help them essentially.

00:51:23.72
Mike
Right.

00:51:24.54
Breeze 
Even in like things like they would train them in media, like how to talk to the media, how to handle themselves in interviews.

00:51:28.70
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:51:31.20
Breeze 
um So I've kind of modernized it a little bit. um I mean artists still do need help talking in front of camera, even on podcasts.

00:51:39.70
Mike
Sure.

00:51:40.37
Breeze 
but just understanding that they are a brand and a business first they're not just an artist and because when you're when you're just walking around acting like just an artist that's when people can come along and exploit you whereas if you're understanding that you're actually a business and

00:51:51.62
Mike
Right.

00:52:00.11
Breeze 
Everything you do, the goal is, I want to be profitable at some time, like every other business sits down with their plan.

00:52:06.38
Mike
right

00:52:07.79
Breeze 
um The conversations are different, the focus is different, everything's more intentional. um So it's just helping, that's at like the base of it is helping under artists understand their business owners, their CEOs, they the boss.

00:52:22.34
Mike
Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

00:52:23.52
Breeze 
And they're responsible for their branding and out from there building out, you know, what is your business plan? So what is your vision? um What are the values that, you know, are important to you? And then in that, um I'm very big on how do we then build around that, build around your strengths to also keep the joy in what you're doing? Because I think like if you can at least balance your life the best the best way possible to have more joy than anything.

00:53:03.87
Breeze 
I just feel like you're just a better human being anyway, but um but also when it does come to this industry, there's just a lot of different industries meshed into one place.

00:53:04.12
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:53:07.92
Bill
Right.

00:53:14.81
Breeze 
So it's not just music, it's entertainment, it's content, it's branding, it's

00:53:14.90
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:53:21.02
Breeze 
brand partnerships, it's um TV, it's um publication, it's all these sorts of things that are just meshed into one.

00:53:21.56
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:53:32.10
Breeze 
So it's just helping an artist really understand the roles of the industry, who they're talking to, um how to talk to these people. um And at the same time, knowing who they're talking to.

00:53:45.04
Breeze 
So who are your audience? And why are they your audience? And a lot of that comes out of the self-discovery.

00:53:49.70
Mike
Mm-hmm

00:53:53.25
Breeze 
The people who are going to resonate with you, the most ah most likely the people that look like you. you know It's like your vibe attracts your tribe.

00:54:01.20
Mike
Right Mm-hmm

00:54:02.58
Breeze 
so um It's funny because like a lot of the concepts came out of um so like what I was learning in sobriety, like just like learning a lot of these different aspects of myself, understanding my uniqueness and how that's important.

00:54:12.28
Mike
Mm-hmm

00:54:20.34
Breeze 
It's better for me and for others if I'm being my unique self and I'm accepting my unique self.

00:54:26.17
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:54:27.66
Breeze 
um in the music industry it's very much like we're gonna mold you into what already works and I just think it's just like we're in a very different time now that it's um it's time to do things differently like that like that's kind of where it came from um I would the beginning of my sobriety tell myself to do things differently so it's like if I was met with you know a temptation or just a

00:54:34.25
Mike
Right.

00:54:58.12
Breeze 
Old habits were kind of coming about it's like okay I'm gonna do it different this time because that is the definition of insanity is what we learn and and so it's just kind of that's why I think I also named my company differently because it's just this constant reminder of

00:55:02.12
Mike
Mm hmm. Great.

00:55:17.61
Breeze 
We're all different at the core, like we're all unique we're and we're all meant to be that way.

00:55:19.38
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:55:23.00
Breeze 
And I think we don't have to be molded or fit into this formula in order to have something that is successful.

00:55:33.54
Breeze 
Yes, like of course you want to make money off what you're doing, but really more importantly,

00:55:37.41
Mike
Hmm.

00:55:40.74
Breeze 
have some kind of purpose to what we're doing, which I think if you can if you can focus on the value first, the the money always comes.

00:55:47.91
Mike
Right.

00:55:50.06
Breeze 
I just think money is a resource. It's not like really anything that special. It's it's just like, I think that will naturally attract to you, um but really artists need a plan.

00:55:54.57
Mike
right

00:56:01.62
Breeze 
And um my brain fucking loves working that way. Like it likes, yeah it just likes to look at things

00:56:06.52
Mike
if you

00:56:10.77
Breeze 
and sees where it could be more efficient and it yeah it's crazy. I've learned to like really love this part of myself because it's interesting because this was the part of me that was always told to dim down.

00:56:26.72
Breeze 
you know like you know You hear those recurring things that are told to you your whole life.

00:56:27.19
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:56:31.85
Breeze 
It was funny how this was the one part that seemingly now what helps this business run is my brain.

00:56:37.17
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:56:39.97
Breeze 
And so um I've i'm finding joy in finally just personally being in a place where my environment now is the value in that.

00:56:52.52
Breeze 
So um if I can give that value, then artists can find their value and and it's just, you know, Russian dolls for all day, you know.

00:57:01.70
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:57:03.50
Breeze 
So yeah, a lot of it is doing a lot of my favorite things too. um talking, negotiating, like all all of that planning, strategy.

00:57:16.68
Breeze 
um And what I love about it is um every artist is so different in what they want. And i I want to create environments where I encourage those parts and they can feel like those parts can be strengthened.

00:57:34.09
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:57:34.77
Breeze 
Instead of led to feel like they can't be that because you know The song won't get on radio or they won't be able to become established and I just think that's bullshit like For a long time.

00:57:44.13
Mike
Right.

00:57:50.68
Breeze 
It's being shown that that's not the only way ah because it's like YouTube's been around for ah a very long time and we can see that as a very um easy example of Many different brands in many different niches, building platforms and monetizing from it, you know?

00:58:07.34
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

00:58:10.85
Breeze 
So I just think it's about time that, at least in the music industry, we can kind of catch up, you know?

00:58:18.95
Mike
Right.

00:58:19.04
Breeze 
um And just already seeing, I'm working with like 11 different artists right now, um already seeing dramatic changes um with them in terms of just their focus and their mindset.

00:58:19.16
Bill
Right.

00:58:36.91
Breeze 
you know um I think a lot of it is just articulation. They can now articulate things that were that they were feeling. and

00:58:46.51
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:58:47.61
Breeze 
um Yeah, they're becoming like little bosses. I just kind of feel like so i i just feel like so proud because i'm just like I feel like a proud mom sometimes where I'm just like, fuck yeah.

00:58:52.14
Mike
ah fifty fifty fifty

00:58:58.89
Breeze 
like You took initiative.

00:59:00.39
Mike
Right?

00:59:00.87
Breeze 
like you youre You're a boss and you're acting like a boss.

00:59:01.67
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:59:03.83
Breeze 
I literally high-fived an artist as um the other week because I was like, now you're sounding like a fucking business owner.

00:59:08.39
Mike
Hehehehe.

00:59:09.77
Breeze 
like And I'm like, that's good, because you know I explained to them, like every other business, when they're entering into a discussion about partnerships, they know the numbers.

00:59:21.52
Breeze 
like They know what they're worth, they know their value, they know even who's across the table.

00:59:22.31
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:59:26.83
Breeze 
like If a label ever went to any, if that situation was put in any other business meeting, like it would not happen.

00:59:35.83
Mike
Hmm.

00:59:36.81
Breeze 
like You wouldn't even make it past reception. like

00:59:39.70
Mike
Right.

00:59:40.50
Breeze 
It's not normal for a label to go to someone who's 15 years old who has a viral song on TikTok being like, let me sign your intellectual property away and we'll give you this cash advance that you have to pay back.

00:59:45.27
Mike
Hmm.

00:59:54.17
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:59:59.89
Breeze 
But we haven't even really vetted anything. We haven't tested anything. We don't even know if the product's good or sustainable. So we're just going to drop you at your next single because there is no other thought put to this than we're really fucking good at making money off of viral songs.

01:00:17.27
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:00:18.10
Breeze 
And that's about it. And I just think it's like a total exploitation, especially when it's with people that are under the age of 18.

01:00:19.57
Mike
Right.

01:00:22.05
Mike
Of course.

01:00:25.02
Breeze 
I just think that's fucking weird. And I've always thought it's weird.

01:00:27.11
Mike
Mm.

01:00:27.97
Breeze 
like

01:00:28.41
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:00:29.70
Bill
So do you do you think that you were always, cause you mentioned like the ah putting these, seeing these things and putting these pieces together and there was an area that was always dimmed.

01:00:29.70
Breeze 
I just, yeah.

01:00:39.68
Bill
Do you think you always have that analytical side to you, be able to, I don't know, decipher these things? It sounds like you're, you almost are are trying to put together puzzles for people, which is kind of cool, but it's an analytical part.

01:00:48.93
Breeze 
Yeah. I love fun.

01:00:51.22
Bill
You're trying to pick apart these little pieces and put them into, put this puzzle together and say, okay, Now this is what, here's where you can get better and grow. Do you think that was always in you and being sober now has opened you up or?

01:01:03.29
Breeze 
I think definitely being sober has definitely added a lot more clarity to it, but I've always has i've have always been that way. like Even when I was as an artist, I was doing all of these things.

01:01:17.60
Bill
Okay.

01:01:17.64
Breeze 
um But I was doing it out of necessity, because who else was going to do it?

01:01:23.38
Mike
Right.

01:01:23.61
Breeze 
you know And so when i when I took that artist label away and then understood it's not normal, these aren't normal skills.

01:01:24.78
Bill
right

01:01:35.20
Breeze 
like It's a very specialized thing. like You have to kind of have a passion for it and I love doing it. I think that's why I was feeling that tension of, I feel like I've seen something I can't unsee now.

01:01:48.70
Breeze 
like So much of me now makes sense when I'm not just You know, touring or being a drummer or a producer or whatever it is, you know, like an artist, all of these, this whole other side to me now felt like it actually had a place in my life. Whereas before that, it was like.

01:02:10.60
Breeze 
i I'm an artist, I shouldn't enjoy the business the music business. like I shouldn't enjoy negotiating or understanding contracts or understanding strategy or all of this stuff that I love doing and not just in the music industry. My my brain has always been like that. It just loves being a problem solver and it sometimes can be to my detriment because then I can try and fix things and some things don't need to be fixed.

01:02:41.18
Breeze 
So I'm learning how to like be mature in it.

01:02:44.51
Bill
Right, but the but the cool part though is that, I mean, when you're helping these artists, you have the ability to say, okay, I was doing all these things.

01:02:44.66
Breeze 
um

01:02:52.68
Bill
I've already, I've been there. I'm um um an artist.

01:02:54.14
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:02:54.94
Bill
I've been behind the kit. I've been in the band. i've I was doing these things, like you said, on a necessity. I can show you a way. It's kind of like, you know again, like like Mike said before, you know the these things that we learn about helping other alcoholics.

01:03:07.47
Bill
I mean, I i don't want to,

01:03:08.36
Breeze 
Mm hmm.

01:03:10.11
Bill
I don't mind hanging out with somebody you know that's you know two three two, three years sober. I think I can learn a lot from somebody in that that one to three year period because people have more fire in them at that than I'll be quite honest than I do at 14 and a half years.

01:03:25.38
Breeze 
Right.

01:03:25.62
Bill
um I've got this thing down. I've got this ah this routine down.

01:03:27.66
Breeze 
Mm

01:03:29.03
Bill
i'm I'm comfortable in my own skin and I know what works and I thankfully having to figure out, I haven't had to figure out in too bad a ways what doesn't work, right?

01:03:31.06
Breeze 
hmm.

01:03:38.13
Bill
You know, but um the thing of it is, though, is if I really want to learn something about long-term sobriety, I'm going to go talk to somebody who's been sober for 20 years, but to has good sobriety, not just, you know, 20 years under their belt.

01:03:51.16
Bill
I want them to be happy and accomplished and those sort of things.

01:03:53.31
Breeze 
h

01:03:54.50
Bill
you know It's the same deal. Now you come to these artists with with this whole thing. you know I've been doing this since I was 12. I've been through all this different stuff. This is my passion, but these are the things I've learned. have you been a i mean Do you think that's gotta be a huge advantage, right?

01:04:10.43
Breeze 
Yeah, because I think Um, it helps them understand it's kind of like when you, when you run into someone else and you both find out you sober, like you just instantly know, you know, like, okay, cool.

01:04:21.89
Bill
Right.

01:04:24.77
Breeze 
We don't have to say much, but we know, you know, you just instantly feel comfortable.

01:04:27.96
Bill
Right.

01:04:27.95
Mike
Right.

01:04:30.70
Breeze 
And I think. Um, that's definitely a huge advantage because I can say like, Hey, and I can pick it up as well. You know, I can pick up the limiting belief, you know, that they might not be aware of, but I'm like it sticking out like a sore thumb because it's like, I had the same.

01:04:48.77
Breeze 
limiting beliefs and um mixed with my personality I think I can i can get to the problem a lot quicker and and and in a way there's ah more of a respect there because I'm not just some industry person that's never been in their position. like you know I can say i I've played to literally no one in the middle of nowhere, but then I've played to 65,000 people in in some of the biggest places in Australia. so i've I've done what where they're at, but I've also done where they're wanting to be, or at least in their mind's eye.

01:05:28.16
Breeze 
they'd love to achieve one day. So I think there is that element of a trust there, whereas it's different to some guy in a suit that's like, was probably bullied in high school and, you know, isn't exactly a shock caller in the industry, but wants to present himself as someone who can call the shots.

01:05:39.37
Mike
Right.

01:05:45.02
Mike
All right.

01:05:47.31
Breeze 
And um They're usually the ones that exploit the artists, so they're the ones that you can sniff them out from a mile away, you know?

01:05:52.21
Mike
This is.

01:05:57.25
Mike
This is.

01:05:57.62
Breeze 
It's just kind of like, okay.

01:06:01.49
Bill
So you you mentioned like the the YouTubes and the viral stuff and and all those sort of things. And I listened to a ton of podcasts. I mean, everything from, you know, Sowbrick podcast and musicians. Yeah, I could talk musicians to, you know, actors and all those sort of things. And ah comedians too, you know, mark ah Mike and I listen to Mark Maron all the time. And, you know, like one of the big things that people are talking now about like comedians, for instance, I'm i'm guessing it's the same thing with some of these viral musical artists.

01:06:30.25
Bill
is that you know anyone can pick up um you know decent camera up you know I have a computer and they can they can do their routine their comedy routine to release it and there's a couple I can't think of the guy he just had a Netflix special the guy's huge he blew up he's a comedian he's in his 20s late 20s I think

01:06:35.83
Breeze 
Mm hmm.

01:06:46.72
Breeze 
Oh, Matt Rife.

01:06:48.20
Bill
There you go, Matt Rife.

01:06:48.51
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:06:50.06
Bill
That dude, I'm like, it he's funny-ish, you know, and whatever. I mean, he's he's definitely honed his craft and done the work. But literally in two years, he went from nothing to he's worth like, I don't know, $10 million dollars now or something like that.

01:07:03.02
Bill
You know, and it was all because of YouTube and TikTok and all those sort of things. And a couple of things these things went viral and he got his break. So is that what you're talking about? You're seeing you're seeing people or these record labels are seeing people and they see a video of viral and they just wanna sign somebody, squeeze the shit out of them, set them aside.

01:07:19.18
Breeze 
hu

01:07:22.00
Breeze 
Pretty much it'd be like, um, I mean, TikTok's are very known for it. And there's like literally people, their job at labels is to look for viral songs on TikTok.

01:07:33.47
Breeze 
And because, because they don't want the artists, they want the master recording, they want to own the song, the competition that like, you know,

01:07:33.53
Bill
I guess that doesn't surprise me.

01:07:43.51
Bill
Right.

01:07:45.08
Breeze 
because that's how they make their money. And then they just run it through their system and they can make massive and massive amounts of money from owning a viral song because it's got the attention. So labels are really good at doing that. It's just, is it ethical? I don't know. Like, because a lot of them are young that they don't know anything about business. Their parents don't know anything about business. Are they even worth really what the song Can be worth no like do they have any money management skills a team around them um The the established lifestyle that they're about to be um You know

01:08:31.57
Breeze 
Brought into ah in terms of the massive amount of tearing they have to do the pressure that comes with that because what artists don't understand is like you were joining multi-million dollar corporations like These and the it it's like now you're responsible for that

01:08:44.03
Bill
Right.

01:08:49.93
Breeze 
And I remember when we did our arena stint, I had that thought. I was like, oh shit, if we don't do a good job, like these are like not just, you know, your friends down the street or just some small business owner. These are like massive businesses that you're like fucking up in front of.

01:09:06.64
Breeze 
um and And so it's like, there is there is a lot of like that aspect to it of like, do you even have a, are you show ready? Are you ready for that? And you know, labels used to help artists get ready for that.

01:09:22.16
Breeze 
um Because when you're playing in front of a lot of people and just even the um lifestyle of being out on the road, like it's it's not a very healthy lifestyle.

01:09:34.68
Breeze 
like it's It's not healthy to stand out on stage and have 10,000 people screaming at you how much they love you. and not like That's not a normal thing for a human, so it's just kind of like you have to be

01:09:44.84
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

01:09:52.59
Breeze 
mature, you have to at least have a bit of self-esteem and also have really good people around you to support you.

01:10:00.12
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:10:02.01
Breeze 
because um

01:10:04.10
Mike
Because you'll fucking believe it.

01:10:05.82
Breeze 
Yeah, because literally, because because those things are vanity, it's is's very fleeting.

01:10:05.96
Mike
Otherwise, right.

01:10:13.12
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:10:13.82
Breeze 
And and also the just chemically what that does to your brain. like There was um a lot of articles written on it um about like how depression is like a huge thing amongst the the like the managers, but a lot of touring musicians.

01:10:19.19
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:10:31.77
Breeze 
like they

01:10:31.81
Mike
All right.

01:10:32.85
Breeze 
have a lot of depression just because it's like this this high hit and then a very then you're not then you come off tour and you can't get that hit anymore.

01:10:37.68
Mike
Yeah. And then right.

01:10:41.45
Breeze 
Honestly, it's a drug. like Really.

01:10:43.46
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:10:44.43
Breeze 
so

01:10:44.64
Mike
Yeah. What do you do with those other 23 hours?

01:10:45.39
Breeze 
you know

01:10:47.89
Breeze 
Right.

01:10:48.83
Mike
Okay.

01:10:48.96
Breeze 
um And so if you if you don't have good people around you or someone that you can talk about these things with, you're going to align your worth with external validation.

01:10:49.05
Bill
Yeah.

01:10:59.09
Mike
That that one hour. Yeah.

01:11:00.53
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:11:01.39
Mike
Yeah, exactly.

01:11:01.43
Breeze 
And, you know, what people are telling you.

01:11:03.12
Mike
and it's fake, right?

01:11:04.18
Breeze 
Yeah. the vaned the the It isn't real.

01:11:04.90
Mike
Yeah, it's not real. I mean, it's it's it's real to the point that it's happening at that moment, but it's not it's not real. Those people do not love you.

01:11:13.22
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:11:14.74
Mike
you know They may enjoy what you're doing and they're having a good time and whatever.

01:11:15.85
Breeze 
No, because they will cancel you if you say something wrong.

01:11:19.60
Mike
Yeah, exactly. But yeah, the the fact of the matter is they don't love you, um not not really. And if you don't have people that actually do love you, then you're fucked.

01:11:29.09
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:11:29.16
Mike
Yeah, I've seen it plenty of times myself, right?

01:11:31.32
Breeze 
Yep, yeah.

01:11:31.92
Bill
Yeah, I was gonna say you've had you had that and I don't know we I think we talked about that briefly a little bit in the last time we talked to you Breeze but I mean Mike had his stint in the in the music biz right back in the 80s I mean the Jew is it is it some of this stuff kind of coming back to you now or

01:11:32.24
Breeze 
yeah

01:11:41.87
Mike
Yep.

01:11:45.16
Mike
Oh, yeah. Right. Yeah. Well, it's making him me remember why I walked the fuck away from it because it was horrible.

01:11:52.50
Mike
you know, i and that and it was getting in the way of me getting loaded.

01:11:54.41
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:11:55.32
Mike
But, um, but I also, you know, yeah, it was, it's, it's fucking awful. The buying and selling of art is a fucking miserable business. Um, on any level. I mean, I was a very, do a fashion model.

01:12:06.22
Mike
So I saw that side of it too. Yes. It is all the buying and selling of art. And it's very, very painful to the artist. Yeah. It's, it's hard, you know, and if you don't have a certain,

01:12:15.84
Breeze 
yep h

01:12:19.20
Mike
Whatever. Like I said, you know, those, those really good people around you to support you and keep it and also keep you grounded. You're fucked.

01:12:26.14
Breeze 
Yeah, yeah.

01:12:27.08
Mike
Yeah.

01:12:27.68
Breeze 
it And a lot of it is like, what I'm big on is like, what are you placing your value in?

01:12:27.78
Mike
Yeah.

01:12:32.74
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:12:32.84
Breeze 
It's like, don't place your value in the metrics of everything.

01:12:37.35
Mike
Right.

01:12:37.59
Breeze 
That's ah that's a tool to understand. um Again, like how other businesses, if it's a good business, they'll have someone come in and analyze all their daughter being like,

01:12:44.32
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:12:49.68
Breeze 
where are we doing really well and where can we save a bit of money? you know And it's like, that's the way you have to look at it.

01:12:54.63
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:12:56.97
Breeze 
you know It's like you you have these departments and over a certain period of time, go back and look at these things as how can you understand the way your business is maneuvering?

01:12:57.13
Mike
Yeah, absolutely.

01:13:08.87
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:13:09.17
Breeze 
Are you doing really well on merch? Well, does that mean you invest more money in marketing that? Because you know you can make a bit of more.

01:13:16.55
Mike
Right.

01:13:17.96
Breeze 
bit more um

01:13:18.55
Mike
Right.

01:13:19.49
Breeze 
Um, thinking it strategically, you know, not.

01:13:23.20
Mike
Right. And it's, and it's really hard to separate because, you know, again, artists, right?

01:13:28.70
Breeze 
Mm-hmm.

01:13:28.88
Mike
You're creating art and that's very emotional and very personal. And, and, and, and, but yeah, but then you're trying to sell that very emotional, personal thing.

01:13:33.32
Breeze 
Yes.

01:13:37.72
Breeze 
Yep.

01:13:39.67
Mike
And that's, that's fucking hard to separate me.

01:13:42.56
Breeze 
Yeah and that's why it's like trying to understand where's the artist brain and where do we leave the artist brain and then who is right in front of me right now like what who do I need to play like what role do I need to play right now and

01:13:43.96
Mike
Yeah.

01:13:49.72
Mike
Right. Uh-huh.

01:13:55.76
Mike
Right. Mm hmm.

01:13:58.38
Breeze 
And that's why I i say like you're a business owner, you're not an artist. like That is a part of you and if you can build this to a certain level to where you can hire other people to handle more of the business stuff so you can spend more of your time.

01:14:02.94
Mike
Right.

01:14:10.46
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:14:13.73
Mike
Sure.

01:14:16.26
Breeze 
doing what you enjoy doing.

01:14:16.35
Mike
On the art. Right.

01:14:18.14
Breeze 
Um, but even then you're still responsible for this thing.

01:14:20.80
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:14:21.35
Breeze 
So it is possible because it's already being done when you look at it at like the established music industry side, there's still that.

01:14:26.22
Mike
Sure.

01:14:29.77
Mike
who

01:14:32.30
Breeze 
It's just a lot of changing the ideologies around, which is like just.

01:14:35.50
Mike
Absolutely. You know, and and there's also, and there's also, I mean, I've got friends that are just solid working musicians. I mean, you know, it's their fucking job, man.

01:14:42.78
Breeze 
Yep.

01:14:45.03
Mike
They go out and they may, they play the music and then they live their lives.

01:14:49.31
Breeze 
Exactly.

01:14:49.58
Mike
um Those are the, those are really successful ones. A buddy of mine that I kind of started out with, um Yeah, I mean, he's, you know, he, he goes out and tours with established bands.

01:15:00.31
Mike
He's a bass player. And I mean, he's at the moment, he's building a house in Costa Rica. And, you know, I mean, he's yeah, right.

01:15:06.34
Breeze 
I love that.

01:15:08.23
Mike
I mean, you know, but I mean, he's pretty anonymous. He goes out on, you know, with shit. Mostly at this point, it's like 80s hair bands and stuff. He just goes out and works for him.

01:15:20.16
Mike
And that's what he does. And he's kind of really fucking good life doing it. um But that's not, you know, he's not, he's not an artist anymore.

01:15:23.97
Breeze 
Yeah. Yeah.

01:15:28.45
Mike
He's a, he's, he goes out and he puts the notes where they need to be. And he builds the little wall of sound and then he goes home. Yeah.

01:15:36.89
Breeze 
Yeah. And, and that's, and that's it. It's like, I think allowing an artist to sit there and think about like, what is it that I actually want to do?

01:15:46.78
Mike
Right.

01:15:46.84
Breeze 
I think a lot of it is, I just want to live a simple life where I can just enjoy what I'm doing.

01:15:50.96
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:15:51.91
Breeze 
And I'm like, all right, let's do it.

01:15:52.52
Mike
Right.

01:15:53.93
Breeze 
Like let's build around that because that is so possible.

01:15:56.16
Mike
Yep. Yeah, it is. Yes, you can be you can just and and not be famous and and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

01:15:59.68
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:16:03.29
Mike
Just fucking work and you work hard and and you make fucking really good living.

01:16:05.02
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:16:07.63
Mike
and And then, yeah, you know, by the time you hit sixty five, you fucking retire and nobody hears from you again.

01:16:09.26
Breeze 
Mmhmm.

01:16:14.31
Mike
It's beautiful.

01:16:15.90
Bill
Yeah, well, and that's and that's the thing too that, in once again, we've talked about it on here that, you know, I don't know if you know this, but Mike and I are a couple of years older than you, just a couple.

01:16:26.09
Mike
Right.

01:16:26.49
Bill
Like like a lot of couple of years, but 22, 25, what are you, 32? Yeah, 25 and 23 years, okay, so just, we're a couple of years older than you.

01:16:31.97
Breeze 
Nice.

01:16:36.77
Breeze 
nice

01:16:36.85
Bill
But up until, I would say easily, shit, maybe yeah five years ago, 10 years ago,

01:16:41.52
Breeze 
Mm

01:16:44.28
Bill
um I was still on that you know I want to be this and I want to do this and I want to I want to grow kind of in that not I didn't want to be in like a big company corporate America type of thing but I was still in that mode I'm gonna make my mark you know and I'm gonna do this and it was about position and title and and finally I don't know probably a handful of years ago I decided I'm like you know what fuck every bit of that

01:16:58.36
Breeze 
-hmm

01:17:08.62
Bill
I mean, literally, I'm done. I don't want to be any of that anymore. The job I'm at now, which I've been there for, I don't know, seven months, eight months, whatever it's been now. um I went back from, you know, and i've I've done a lot of things. I've never been, I've never made, you know, millions I've never done. I've made decent livings and done all that stuff. I've been Management positions and supervisors and trainers and I've been known in different groups and all those different things And you know what at times it made me happy, but I was done with it I don't want to manage people.

01:17:37.48
Bill
I don't want to deal with fucking people anymore. I don't want to have all that responsibility anymore I'm too fucking old and tired don't want to have to do any of that shit anymore So I took a job as a collector.

01:17:44.28
Breeze 
Right.

01:17:49.04
Bill
I work for a law firm. It's remote No residency restrictions. I can make a ton of money on commission once I get all that built up. And all I gotta do is every fucking day I clock in at eight o'clock.

01:17:59.70
Breeze 
Yep.

01:18:01.95
Bill
I take two 15 minute breaks throughout the day. I take a half hour lunch from Monday through Thursday. An hour lunch on Friday and I'm out at three o'clock on Friday. Done, and I can go live my life.

01:18:12.98
Bill
And I'm fine with that. Kind of like Mike said, it made it reminded me of that again, because we talk about it every once in a while, but when you're talking about the bassist, all he does is he goes out, puts the notes in the right thing.

01:18:23.27
Bill
That's all I do. I get on the phone, I make this i hit the statistics that I have to, which pays me a certain amount of money, and I do the work, and I make a little bit more money, and that sort of thing, and I'm i'm just fine.

01:18:33.38
Bill
you know i don't want to I don't want to be anything anymore, but just I want to work so I can go out and experience shit. That's what I want to do.

01:18:41.68
Breeze 
yeah Yeah, you want to enjoy your life.

01:18:46.00
Bill
Yeah. I mean, I don't, I don't give a fuck anymore. Somebody in literally, if I don't try to dress up, you know, what I do, if somebody asks what I do, I'm a bill collector.

01:18:48.74
Breeze 
yeah

01:18:54.16
Bill
That's exactly what I do. There'll be people like, well, what kind of bills do you collect? I mean, yeah, I work for a law firm and we collect, you know, from businesses for insurance stuff. It's a couple of steps ahead of collecting from a, you know, um, this, the single mom for her medical bill.

01:19:07.42
Bill
Okay. But it's still a goddamn bill collector. The guy who picks up your trash at the end of the driveway every week, he's a fucking garbage collector. I don't care what he calls himself. They make a lot of money too.

01:19:18.19
Bill
And I'm not poo pooing a garbage collector, but the sanitation engineer, fucking bullshit, all these titles that they put on people, fuck you.

01:19:22.92
Breeze 
ha

01:19:25.44
Bill
You're a garbage collector. Pick up your garbage, make the money that I know you make a lot of money doing it. Enjoy yourself and go fucking home and have fun. but It just doesn't matter, you know?

01:19:33.20
Breeze 
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

01:19:36.75
Bill
But so let let me ask you this. So somebody comes to you and they're like, man, I don't wanna deal with all this business stuff. I would just wanna learn how to how to grow. I wanna be big. I wanna do this.

01:19:47.42
Bill
If somebody has these, and I wouldn't even say unrealistic, but somebody has these expectations and they don't wanna deal with all the business part of it.

01:19:48.09
Breeze 
Hmm.

01:19:55.04
Bill
um I don't know, what would you say to a person like that?

01:20:01.51
Breeze 
If they don't want, if they don't want to handle, I probably ask them just more questions being like, well, I want to understand when you're saying business stuff, like what are you meaning by it?

01:20:12.34
Breeze 
Because it if it could be, um, they don't want to handle like being their own manager or they weren't, they don't want to like do the bookings or they don't want to, um,

01:20:24.99
Breeze 
you know whatever it is I think I would want to understand where they're coming from with that but if they were coming from a place where they're just like I just want the all the results with no work um I just want to post my song once and it goes viral I would probably be like you may need to realign

01:20:49.72
Breeze 
Why you're doing this because um that isn't going to I just like in my mind scream like, oh, you're an addict.

01:20:51.68
Bill
Right.

01:20:58.83
Mike
right

01:21:00.15
Bill
Well, in and so so here's the thing, that's why I asked that question. i was i was I was trying to, because all these things you're saying keep bringing me back to the sobriety shit.

01:21:04.18
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:21:08.57
Breeze 
No, no, yeah.

01:21:09.29
Bill
So um it was making me think of somebody walking in saying, i just tell me how to tell me how to get sober. I don't wanna do this stuff, just tell me how to get sober.

01:21:16.30
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:21:16.52
Bill
So that was that was cool. I mean, first of all, the pause, the reason I laughed is because you pause, because I know you were thinking, trying to figure out the right way how you would actually approach this person by saying, you're a fucking idiot, this is gonna happen that way.

01:21:21.64
Mike
Mmhmm. Right!

01:21:28.47
Breeze 
Yes.

01:21:28.63
Bill
um you know But then saying, yeah, I think you need to reassess and realign. That's what made me laugh, though that was great. then it's The reason I asked that question, it just all of this reminds me of, again, of of somebody getting in and trying to get sober and I was trying to teach them that.

01:21:43.75
Bill
And it just it it makes me smile the fact that you're able to the work that you're doing lines up, I don't know, to me, almost mirrors this whole sobriety thing. It's just kind of cool.

01:21:51.97
Breeze 
It really does. Yeah. Every day I'm like, Oh, I could probably give them the fourth step or something. You know, like I could probably be like, Oh, it's like, you know, take inventory like of this.

01:22:05.32
Breeze 
And because I just think like, you know, a lot of that are great principles for life anyway. And I think, you know, people that, you know, we've been through it.

01:22:12.85
Bill
Right.

01:22:15.95
Breeze 
lo We understand that it's just um I think For all of this, um for for me to be effective in it, I have to be um very curious about the way people are coming to some kind of like understanding on something. you know what Even if I already know this is a little bit silly, the way that you are aligning this thought with like that's not realistic or it's you know not there's no real purpose to it.

01:22:51.55
Breeze 
I never want to come across as like closed off to somebody if they were like I just want to be famous and be like well actually yeah there is a strategy to do that but are you going to be happy?

01:23:01.99
Breeze 
Are you going to be effective?

01:23:02.76
Bill
Right.

01:23:03.59
Breeze 
Are you going to be a good person? Are you going to have purpose in your life? Are you going to be, you know, your quality of life is going to be low. And I think majority of people don't want fame. They they want a good quality of life, you know, and I think it's just.

01:23:22.32
Breeze 
I think it's probably the main reason why labels got rid of artist development because it is a process. It's like the word development. like that Things need to take time ah to marinate. you know and Sometimes it might be a concept needs to take time. They don't want things. They want they want fast fashion. you know So to why I um like what I'm doing is because it's like, I'll take all the time in the world with someone who's really willing to get better at something, you know, whether it's they do want to sober up or they do just want to be better at being an artist.

01:24:01.52
Breeze 
Because at the core of every artist is they want to impact the world in a positive way. Like, you could...

01:24:06.96
Mike
right

01:24:08.60
Breeze 
See it all the time. like I just want people to be happy. That's just a very shallow way of saying, I want to give something that is positive and impactful, you know? el So it's just helping them understand in deeper ways what they're actually saying.

01:24:19.02
Bill
right

01:24:23.95
Breeze 
And honestly, that's like what I feel like I've discovered my life purpose in because I love deep conversations. I love thinking about things and overthinking.

01:24:35.34
Breeze 
I wouldn't even say an overthinking is the right word, but you know what I mean.

01:24:37.60
Bill
Right.

01:24:39.09
Breeze 
like I like to dive further than the deep.

01:24:39.56
Bill
Right.

01:24:39.87
Mike
right

01:24:41.96
Breeze 
you know

01:24:43.17
Mike
Yeah. Actually thinking, not just, you know, it's not just having a thought.

01:24:43.85
Breeze 
um Yes. Yeah, and just really understanding.

01:24:47.96
Bill
right

01:24:49.52
Breeze 
like I mean, my first six months of sobriety, I was sitting under a tree thinking about everything and talking to God about it. like I think it's like I reached that level of crazy, which I think I might add in to my development.

01:25:03.02
Breeze 
um I might be like,

01:25:03.35
Mike
Absolutely.

01:25:04.52
Breeze 
Hey, your first six months, you're going to go isolate, go sit under a tree and just think about all the things you've done and, you know, you know, have this spiritual ah awakening.

01:25:13.21
Bill
ah

01:25:15.02
Breeze 
Um, but I find just a lot of value in that. And, um, yeah, I'm honestly just like very. happy with where I'm at as as I took a moment the other day to just kind of like let myself know how proud I am of myself because I remember being in a place where I just did not see what my purpose was and why I was even here like I was like my family fucking hates me like and they say they love me but they're just not treating me like they love me like I was you know you're doing the whole blame game and the victim thing

01:25:35.40
Mike
Hmm.

01:25:46.48
Mike
Hmm.

01:25:52.35
Breeze 
But that's the mentality I was in, you know?

01:25:52.52
Bill
Right.

01:25:56.64
Breeze 
So to now be on the other side of that, and now I feel like I've really aligned with this chapter that I'm in, this is what I'm meant to be doing type of thing.

01:26:11.30
Breeze 
um i'm I took a moment to say like, you're breezy, like you're doing a fucking awesome job. Like now, even in your sobriety, you can say the impossible can be made possible, you know?

01:26:18.33
Mike
Right.

01:26:24.18
Breeze 
And I actually have told someone that because they were like, oh, it's just too hard. I'm like, hey, i I'm an alcoholic and I don't drink. So how hard is something really?

01:26:32.90
Mike
So fuck you.

01:26:36.27
Breeze 
Yeah, so like how how hard is something and like, you know, people who who aren't drinkers are like, oh, geez, like, you know.

01:26:36.46
Bill
yeah Really.

01:26:39.21
Mike
Right.

01:26:43.70
Breeze 
So I think it's just like helping people understand like, yes, the impossible is actually really you just breaking out of whatever that limiting belief is and then understanding you are so much more capable of what you are limiting yourself with.

01:26:56.05
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:26:59.73
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:27:00.20
Breeze 
And that's kind of all it is at the end of the day.

01:27:03.41
Mike
It is.

01:27:03.56
Bill
Right.

01:27:04.16
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:27:04.83
Bill
So do you, um i I guess last last question has just kind of occurred to me. Do you find that you've got a lot of, the fact that the labels aren't doing this anymore um and you are, which I think is amazing.

01:27:15.96
Bill
Do you find that you have a lot of competition or is there a lot of competition out there, people doing what you do now?

01:27:21.43
Breeze 
um There are people that do artist development. I think where I'm different is I think a lot of it is rooted in personal development first because i just I just think if you don't have your mind right then everything else just will at some point crumble.

01:27:33.27
Bill
Right.

01:27:40.85
Breeze 
Like you could have a really good content strategy or a really great song and you might have the best marketing ever but still at the end of the day Why are you doing it?

01:27:52.13
Breeze 
And where is where are you attaching your value?

01:27:52.39
Bill
Right.

01:27:54.09
Breeze 
Because even with the best of the best, the people decide if they like something or not. And that's something you can't control. So i I have also arrived at a place where I don't think competition is a real thing.

01:28:10.06
Breeze 
I think where because we're so uniquely made, really refining what that uniqueness is and accepting it to a point where you actually compliment people.

01:28:21.86
Breeze 
So I've really switched out a lot of words um to, you I'm not in competition with anyone, I compliment people.

01:28:22.29
Bill
Right.

01:28:31.03
Breeze 
So I think Yeah, because like there's no one else like me. They can take the concepts, but they're not going to present it the same way, um which I think just relieves so much fucking stress.

01:28:47.88
Breeze 
Oh my gosh.

01:28:48.29
Bill
Right.

01:28:49.30
Breeze 
Yeah. like

01:28:49.77
Bill
No, and I think that's a that's that's an amazing way to look at it because I mean, really what it comes down to is that if I suppose with anything, if you're looking at somebody or something or um another company or whatever it is as a competitor, um then yeah, they're comparing yourselves and you're worrying about what are they doing versus what can I do, blah, blah, blah versus just doing your own thing and being, and fuck it.

01:28:50.59
Breeze 
yeah

01:29:13.47
Bill
nobody's doing it like me anyhow, regardless of if they're doing somewhere along the same lines, I'm me and I'm doing it this way.

01:29:15.64
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:29:19.76
Breeze 
yeah

01:29:19.89
Bill
So fuck everyone else, you know.

01:29:21.45
Breeze 
Yeah, I think there's an element of that.

01:29:22.16
Bill
yeah

01:29:23.26
Breeze 
And I think like there's a healthy competition. So I do look at, um like I was saying before, I like to surround myself with people that are doing things that I haven't accomplished yet because that motivates me.

01:29:26.11
Bill
Right.

01:29:38.51
Breeze 
So it's kind of like if I see someone's posted something about their business or they've got like four new clients this week, I'm like, okay, I'm going to outdo you. You know, like, oh, you're up early posting about this.

01:29:51.38
Breeze 
Okay, I'm going to get up early and post about this. So it's just kind of like a healthy competition. It's not looking at it in a way of like, oh, I'm jealous because you make more money than me.

01:29:57.50
Bill
Great.

01:30:02.42
Breeze 
Or you're saying the same things as me and you're seemingly, you know, got more influence. I kind of see that as like, oh, that's what's possible.

01:30:12.11
Bill
Right.

01:30:12.20
Breeze 
Um, and so it's just, I think that just comes along with the more life you live and there is an element of like, no expectations is really a nice way of saying, I really don't give a fuck at the end of the day.

01:30:26.69
Bill
Right. Yeah, it's kind of where words we live by sometimes, right, Mike?

01:30:29.59
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:30:30.79
Mike
Mm-hmm

01:30:30.93
Breeze 
Yeah. Yeah.

01:30:32.96
Bill
So um and I looked up your your websites, obviously, as we were talking here.

01:30:36.61
Breeze 
Oh, I think it cut out for a second.

01:30:38.32
Bill
So um differently, network.com, correct?

01:30:42.73
Mike
Yeah, he's done that once or twice Yeah, this there he is he's back you sure did Yeah, anyways, so you looked up her websites and I

01:30:44.68
Breeze 
Okay.

01:30:45.04
Bill
What?

01:30:47.02
Breeze 
Oh, there you go. Yeah.

01:30:49.34
Bill
Oh, did I cut out?

01:30:50.26
Breeze 
Yeah. Just for, yep. Yeah.

01:30:51.99
Bill
Oh, well, that's kind of weird, okay. So um i was I was actually, I was still here as far as I knew, but.

01:30:59.84
Breeze 
yeah

01:31:00.57
Bill
No, I was just saying, and I'm looking at it here. So I'm gonna have, same thing as I did on the promo. I'll have your Instagram link in there, but I see your Instagram is on your website anyhow.

01:31:08.24
Breeze 
Yeah.

01:31:09.65
Bill
But all people have to do is if you're listening to this episode now, look in the episode description. I have a link to Breeze's website, okay?

01:31:18.14
Breeze 
yes

01:31:18.85
Bill
and then get people to to your website. It looks like as I'm looking at it, it's got everything. It's got about you, artist and development application, the podcast, the network, um Instagram, Facebook, email, or not Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, and email.

01:31:25.39
Breeze 
Yes.

01:31:33.00
Bill
um So visit that, but also obviously um we follow Breeze on Instagram. She follows us, I think. and No, I know you do.

01:31:39.39
Breeze 
no yeah i I totally follow you guys.

01:31:40.20
Bill
Um, I know, I know you do.

01:31:40.62
Mike
No.

01:31:42.16
Bill
I'm just fine. I'm just fucking with you. Um, but, um, but yeah, so the, the, the last thing I want to say besides thank you, cause I mean, this has been, this has been cool. This went, I mean, we talked, God, I wouldn't, I don't think we talked this much about music with anyone, right?

01:31:54.91
Bill
Like, I mean, it was uh it it was it was really it was cool it was so to me i mean almost relaxing to sit here and talk about something i don't know different like that but also knowing the that the parallels that what you are doing to sobriety is it was fucking blowing my mind which is also cool oh it's red ridiculous yeah it's it's just i just you know i mean

01:32:12.36
Breeze 
Right? It's so nuts. It's every day.

01:32:14.56
Mike
You're basically sponsoring other, you're yeah you're basically sponsoring other musicians, right?

01:32:14.96
Breeze 
I'm like, oh, literally. That's what it feels like. I can make my own 12 steps and everything. I can make my own big book.

01:32:25.64
Bill
it's so it's so funny because we we couldn't we couldn't have sat down and and planned out and said okay we're gonna make this episode you're gonna talk all about music breeze we're gonna make all this sound like sobriety and make it sound really good i i just it fucking blew my mind that it did but

01:32:25.68
Breeze 
That's not really.

01:32:27.03
Mike
yeah

01:32:34.32
Breeze 
Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

01:32:40.87
Bill
um So that that's number one, but also, um and I know this comes from both of us, if there's anything we can do um to help promote you, um you know post about you, whatever you need, if you need our help, you know our podcast, it's not you know the biggest in the world or huge or has a big reach or anything like that, but if there's anything we can do to help you with what you're doing, just let us know, okay?

01:33:01.84
Breeze 
Oh, I appreciate that. And, and likewise, if there's, if there's any, I mean, if you want any of the artists I'm working with, I mean, they're not sober, but if you wanted more musicians on the podcast, maybe yeah, they can, they can totally come on.

01:33:16.89
Bill
You know what, i the the the thing that is here.

01:33:18.68
Mike
We'll wait till they get sober Oh,

01:33:21.97
Breeze 
right they could get they definitely need to be sober and other things for sure no i i work with really really good artists otherwise i wouldn't work with them if i didn't like them

01:33:22.54
Bill
yeah Yeah, because here.

01:33:29.05
Mike
yeah, absolutely a

01:33:33.13
Bill
No, and and this is this is what we tell. We say this openly on here all the time. If anyone wants to be on the podcast, send us an email, approach us. We'll take a look at it, but don't be offended if we say no, because we're not just, just because somebody's referred to us by our friend Breeze, for instance, doesn't mean you're going to end up on here. um You know, because we've we've said no to people because we don't think that either we would do people justice or we don't think that it would blend well with what we're trying to do.

01:33:57.97
Breeze 
Exactly.

01:33:58.28
Bill
if it goes against our values or what like for instance we were approached by how many of the non-alcoholic drink companies like to begin with three or four yeah and then some other ones who like these meditation apps and whatever all these things you don't find I know that any the NA market I have neither one of us have anything wrong with it we're just not any people

01:34:05.21
Mike
yeah Several yeah, yeah It wouldn't be honest

01:34:16.84
Bill
nothing wrong with meditation apps and all that shit it's just if we looked at something like we wouldn't use that we wouldn't drink any beer we would use a meditation app if we don't line up with somebody will just not gonna have a lot because it's it would it would just be an uncomfortable conversation cuz it just i don't know why we've thankfully never had any ah right in in the thing of it is we have we don't have any ability to be fake anymore

01:34:26.74
Breeze 
exactly

01:34:34.80
Breeze 
yeah

01:34:40.25
Bill
we We're too old for that shit, right, Mike?

01:34:41.32
Breeze 
yeah

01:34:42.74
Mike
Absolutely.

01:34:46.18
Breeze 
no that

01:34:46.35
Bill
But seriously, no, any anything we can do, and and like I said, you know what, weve I'll have, and I do have, you know, people are listening to this, obviously the links are in the description, so um yeah, visit Breeze's website, follow her on Instagram, and and I mean, seriously, it's been, this has been a fucking hell of a lot of fun in my mind.

01:34:53.37
Mike
Yes.

01:35:01.80
Breeze 
Yeah. Mmhmm. Yeah. No, thank you. Thank you for having me back on. Cause yeah, this, this has been awesome.

01:35:09.15
Bill
Yeah, it's been great.

01:35:09.21
Mike
yes

01:35:09.47
Breeze 
Awesome. Yeah.

01:35:09.95
Bill
So all right. So Breeze, it's time for you and I to be quiet. You know what you know what's coming up for Mike now.

01:35:13.69
Mike
yeah

01:35:14.16
Breeze 
Oh yeah.

01:35:15.01
Bill
lets He's got a new little thing too, so b be prepared.

01:35:15.47
Breeze 
Here we go.

01:35:17.41
Mike
Yeah.

01:35:17.86
Breeze 
Do I have to make a new song?

01:35:19.58
Bill
ah No, it's it hey i don't know it's a short one, but you you tell us.

01:35:20.42
Mike
All right.

01:35:23.10
Breeze 
Okay.

01:35:24.05
Mike
Well, thank you everyone for listening to another episode of sober not mature. Thank you Breeze for coming on and hanging out with us for a while. It's been fun now.

01:35:34.81
Mike
It is time, it's time for this stuff. So from the bottom of my heart to the depths of my soul, from the beginning of time to the ends of the earth, always and eternally, fuck you. And now it is time, it is time for you to fuck off. Then keep fucking off. Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying you cannot fuck off past here. Climb over that gate, dream the impossible dream and keep fucking off forever.

01:36:06.78
Bill
Yeah, that new little thing our our friend G gave that, uh, said that to us on, or send it to Mike on on Facebook. So how long has that been? Couple of months now that you've been reading it.

01:36:15.29
Mike
Yeah, something like that.

01:36:15.36
Bill
So yeah. And, uh, yeah, we're, we're so fucking superstitious. He added it to it. He can't take it away now. He's stuck with it forever.

01:36:21.51
Mike
Right.

01:36:22.12
Bill
So yeah.

01:36:23.24
Mike
Just like the shit I do for sobriety, man. I can add stuff, but I can't take it away.

01:36:25.26
Breeze 
Yep.

01:36:27.08
Mike
So once it's in there, it's in there.

01:36:29.55
Bill
Exactly. So all right. Well, um again, i can't I can't thank you enough. And I've really, i've I've enjoyed this a lot. And I think i think everyone else will too. So ah Mike, I love you, brother.

01:36:40.12
Mike
Love you too.

01:36:41.34
Bill
And I know that hopefully all of us will talk soon, I believe, right?

01:36:44.49
Mike
Absolutely. I'll see your dumb ass tomorrow.

01:36:47.17
Bill
Yeah, that is true. I'm going to be in Cleveland tomorrow. So all right. Bye, everybody.

01:36:52.50
Mike
Bye.