SoberNotMature - Episode 142 (Take Your Emotional Support Goat To IHOP)

00:00:01.84
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again to another episode of Sober Not Mature. And I'm back in HQ this week.

00:00:11.55
Mike
ha Ah, world headquarters of sober, not mature.

00:00:13.17
Bill
Yeah. yes

00:00:19.04
Bill
When I said HQ, I never thought about, fuck, I could have said world headquarters.

00:00:23.86
Mike
a I don't know.

00:00:24.49
Bill
The fuck is wrong with me? Jesus Christ. Again, like i said like I said, to start out with anything on your mind, you're like, yeah, that's a loaded question.

00:00:30.96
Mike
Yep.

00:00:32.54
Bill
Yeah, and I just I just asked cuz I mean you know you Mike and I talk usually once a week unless you know somebody fucking dies, you know, so um Other that you know, we talk about once a week, you know, it's usually right before this and again 95% of the time we have nothing

00:00:39.43
Mike
Right.

00:00:44.50
Mike
Mm hmm. No.

00:00:48.34
Bill
uh to talk about that we wouldn't uh that we don't just fucking talk about on here but um god damn it world headquarters shit i i feel bad now i just say um i'm disappointed in myself i didn't even feel bad i'm i'm just disappointed in myself but uh yeah so you're in our you're in our cleveland satellite office and i'm at the world the world headquarters

00:00:52.94
Mike
Exactly.

00:01:00.74
Mike
yeah

00:01:06.81
Mike
Right.

00:01:10.98
Mike
Right. Well, I mean it, it all started in the driveway there. So yeah, that's it.

00:01:14.88
Bill
Yeah. You know what that is? That is kind of funny. I mean, yeah, granted, this is where we, it's the address for everything we do for the, you know, obviously for sober and I'm sure they're all the, you know, the quote unquote business shit, but um yeah, literally it did.

00:01:22.04
Mike
isn Right.

00:01:28.04
Bill
It started right in this fucking driveway. So um I have a ah podcast thing to talk about another podcast, which made me think about how that started that day too. So that's another side note.

00:01:35.97
Mike
There are other podcasts.

00:01:37.65
Bill
One, two, maybe, maybe three, if I, four, ma five at the most.

00:01:38.57
Mike
Okay. Okay.

00:01:44.71
Mike
Okay.

00:01:45.40
Bill
Five, there's five of them out there.

00:01:46.21
Mike
Okay.

00:01:47.70
Bill
yeah But I'll get to that anyhow, cause I gotta know what I'm at.

00:01:47.76
Mike
Okay.

00:01:50.67
Bill
But that that is kind of funny. yeah so All this shit started literally coming up on, what was that? Would it have been 2020?

00:01:57.48
Mike
Three years ago.

00:01:58.75
Bill
Yeah, 21, that was Thanksgiving at 21.

00:01:59.91
Mike
Yeah.

00:02:01.03
Bill
So yeah, shit, yeah. The the great idea of this, are our our brain our brain trust got together at you know literally in the driveway during Thanksgiving and produced this fucking shit.

00:02:04.74
Mike
who fall

00:02:11.48
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:02:12.96
Bill
so yeah that's that's about what we could do but um yeah you know what the here's the thing you know i i had these i had this idea because it was a thing that happened this week kind of a big thing and like i wanted to i had some i don't know some light-hearted things and whatever to say about it i'm like you know and after after this week i'm like hey there's nothing to fucking joke about there's there's too much fucking hate you know out there so

00:02:14.01
Mike
Yep.

00:02:23.92
Mike
No.

00:02:33.66
Mike
new Yep.

00:02:37.56
Bill
So i had I had another idea, okay? So I'm gonna read something into the record, if you don't mind. So first of all, a couple of questions for you though, Mike.

00:02:42.50
Mike
Well, please do, the floor is yours.

00:02:47.12
Bill
So I think we've made it clear that we are not in a a sanctioned or sponsored podcast, right?

00:02:52.98
Mike
No, of course not, yeah.

00:02:53.90
Bill
Okay, however, you and I went through the program, are part of the program, Live It Each Day, and live by the steps, traditions, and principles, would you say?

00:02:58.66
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:03:03.61
Mike
Absolutely, hopefully, tryin'. Working on it every fuckin' day.

00:03:08.95
Bill
Again, ah get I fucked up on world headquarters and trying. why can it What's wrong with me tonight? God damn it. I gotta to get back out of the road. I can't think straight here, maybe.

00:03:17.53
Mike
the horror

00:03:18.76
Bill
So I would not have known what tradition this was but I looked it up because I it it kind of made me think about this and maybe we can adopt this at least in the short term if not forever. um This tradition 10 says Alcoholics Anonymous we can just substitute sober not mature has no opinion on outside issues.

00:03:32.71
Mike
Mm-hm.

00:03:39.98
Mike
Right, hence the sober not mature name may not be right.

00:03:40.03
Bill
It's just it's only half of

00:03:45.31
Bill
Right. So again, that's only half of it. The other one talks about obviously throwing A's name and in the mix and blah, blah, blah. But, you know, and I, and I thought about it and it's, it's kind of a lie because we have a lot of opinions, but you know, when it comes down to, um, you know, some of the, uh, again, when, when big things happen that we, uh, we just don't, there's no point, you know, everyone else is, everyone's out there doing the thing.

00:03:55.91
Mike
Oh yeah.

00:04:05.67
Mike
hey

00:04:05.80
Bill
Let's just be rebels and in not talk about what's, let's not talk about the obvious. Right.

00:04:10.22
Mike
Right. The gorilla in the room.

00:04:11.16
Bill
Okay. Yeah, so once again, let me read that again. From our standpoint, sober not mature has no opinion on outside issues, okay?

00:04:20.10
Mike
Right.

00:04:20.98
Bill
Okay, cool, we're we're in agreement?

00:04:21.86
Mike
Yeah. You said issue.

00:04:24.27
Bill
Issue, issues, issues, outside issues. But okay, so there there was another event since you and I talked last, and that i that we can't bring up because I need to congratulate the Detroit fucking Lions for making the Green Bay Packers their bitches last Sunday.

00:04:34.33
Mike
Okay.

00:04:43.37
Bill
ah Okay, so congratulations on on your Lions. They played, and I knew it going in. there The Lions are no fucking joke. They're a really good team.

00:04:53.06
Mike
Right.

00:04:53.22
Bill
um I knew that going in, but i again, everyone can talk about the weather and stuff like that, but I think, ah in unless it wasn't raining and in cold and and crazy conditions on maybe Detroit's side of the field was dry.

00:05:07.15
Mike
Sure.

00:05:07.27
Bill
Maybe, and I i think and when they switch fields, that side of the field got dry in perfect conditions.

00:05:08.07
Mike
Right.

00:05:12.96
Bill
So I'll give that to him. I mean, yeah, they it was unfair because they they didn't have the same conditions of Green Bay did, but.

00:05:19.55
Mike
Sure.

00:05:20.02
Bill
um

00:05:20.83
Mike
Wait, I thought that was the Bears. Dick could control the weather according to his moods.

00:05:26.64
Bill
That's probably the third or fourth time that that saying's that brought up on here and I love it. I thank you, thank you again.

00:05:31.22
Mike
It's my favorite.

00:05:32.41
Bill
I know, it is. so um But here's the thing, I try to take positives out of, again, we talk about not bad days, just bad moments and things like that. That was a bad, what, 60 minutes?

00:05:45.00
Bill
60 minutes. There was a few moments in there that were decent, but the only thing is somebody just looked at the score at the end. That did not tell the story of how shitty that that they played.

00:05:54.87
Mike
Right.

00:05:55.08
Bill
You know, so the the only positive I can take out of it is Green Bay finally has a defense that works because that's the only reason that that score wasn't 54 to 10.

00:06:06.27
Mike
Right.

00:06:07.18
Bill
I mean, seriously, because fucking Detroit, I mean, there were, they, they controlled the entire goddamn game, you know, so.

00:06:12.58
Mike
Hmm. I mean, I i maybe watched seven minutes of it, but all right.

00:06:17.71
Bill
it was it was just the you know It was penalties, and it was all this different stuff.

00:06:20.62
Mike
Hey.

00:06:20.95
Bill
And it was and you know they they couldn't yeah drop passes, drop snaps. It was crazy. There was just so much. But you know Detroit kept those shit together. And i mean Dan Campbell, i mean that dude has done he's done fucking wonders in that in that city.

00:06:33.03
Mike
Right.

00:06:35.32
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:06:35.40
Bill
And um yeah and i wasn't even I wasn't even mad. I was just kind of shaking my head. I'm like, fuck it, man. It's literally, I looked at the score, and I'm like, god, only 24 to 14. That felt far worse.

00:06:46.25
Bill
yeah

00:06:46.62
Mike
um sir

00:06:47.14
Bill
I felt like a larger dildo being shoved up my ass is what it felt like.

00:06:50.12
Mike
Ah,

00:06:51.43
Bill
yeah Well, ah there's an opinion for you. How's that? ah All right. so But I did. I wanted to at least cra congratulate your lines before you had a chance to bring it up and rub it in my face.

00:07:02.36
Bill
so i took

00:07:02.70
Mike
yeah I, I seriously, it was, uh, you know, five days ago, I fucking don't remember yesterday.

00:07:08.20
Bill
I know.

00:07:08.53
Mike
So, right.

00:07:09.30
Bill
I know. Well, I wrote it down because i had I had this whole thing. That was part of my joke. I was going to lead in with something. But again, um let me read that again. So not sure. I'm not going to read it again.

00:07:20.59
Bill
Everyone gets the fucking point. So what we do not necessarily have opinions on, but we do like to spread good words and throw them around in our heads, right?

00:07:30.44
Mike
We do.

00:07:31.55
Bill
So with that, I think, how about a reading there, Michael?

00:07:34.48
Mike
How about it, Michael?

00:07:37.89
Bill
I'm trying to be professional.

00:07:38.06
Mike
ah Wow.

00:07:38.69
Bill
i can't I can't get anything else fucking right.

00:07:41.25
Mike
oh yeah I guess you bar back at world headquarters, right?

00:07:43.80
Bill
Yeah, you know I got my got my shirt and tie on in a whole bit. you know hey

00:07:47.55
Mike
things I'm wearing sweats.

00:07:50.48
Bill
Yeah, I am too.

00:07:50.51
Mike
All right.

00:07:51.64
Bill
Sweat's in a t-shirt, so I fucking lied again.

00:07:54.84
Mike
Wow. All right. Uh, blah, blah, blah. Um, yeah, nothing's jumping out at me. And well, I mean, kind of did. And, um, this is from this week earlier and I'm starting to like not remember what I've read before.

00:08:11.80
Bill
it's okay

00:08:11.97
Mike
I like, I'll read one and I'll go, We do that already. What I need to do is like go back and figure out the ones that I've read before, make a little mark in my books so I won't have that confusion anymore. But ah that didn't happen tonight. So um I think, I don't know. Anyway, let's just try this. Here we go, November 3rd. This was earlier in the week. I did stick my little piece of paper in there. So um it held, maybe it was for the second. But here's the third. Let's try this.

00:08:43.88
Mike
Fear grows out of things we think. It lives in our minds. Compassion grows out of the things we are. It lives in our hearts. Barbara Garrison, don't know, didn't look her up. ah We have been trained to be afraid.

00:09:00.82
Mike
We are afraid of other people. We are afraid of failure. We are afraid of the unknown. We are even afraid of little things such as being late for the bus or wearing the wrong kind of clothes to a gathering. This is the way of addiction. It likes us to be afraid. As addicts, we have often eased our fears with alcohol or drugs.

00:09:24.54
Mike
Our sober self is much braver. We are less self-centered. We focus more on what is in our hearts. We pay attention to other people, not just ourselves, and we actually care about others for a change. Prayer for the day. Higher power helped me stay in the safety of caring about others today. When I think about myself too much, I get in trouble.

00:09:52.44
Mike
Today's action. Today, I will ask myself the following question. when i When I need to do some serious thinking about myself, whom do I trust to help me? I will make sure I go to this person for input and guidance and to avoid the fear that will develop if I isolate myself in my own thoughts.

00:10:15.60
Bill
Well, so what was that?

00:10:16.73
Mike
Right.

00:10:17.92
Bill
like So it's when, when I, when you go to think about yourself, who do you trust to combine it? Correct.

00:10:22.22
Mike
Yeah, basically.

00:10:23.49
Bill
Okay. So, I mean, let's start with that. I mean, do you have situations like, well, first of all, do you sit down and you're like, Hmm, I'm going to think about myself right now.

00:10:29.29
Mike
Hmm.

00:10:34.65
Mike
God, I try not to.

00:10:37.07
Bill
Well, and i yeah that's why I said that the question could be kind of skewed and in that area.

00:10:39.95
Mike
Uh huh.

00:10:40.71
Bill
But um let's just say that you know that that my friend Mike over there was having kind of a fucked up day or whatever, or even a moment and started to think about, I don't know, your your life choices.

00:10:46.43
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

00:10:51.15
Bill
I don't know. Whatever the fuck you want to think about.

00:10:54.68
Mike
Wow.

00:10:54.73
Bill
and

00:10:56.53
Mike
No, I mean, it's funny because I mean, I really don't think about my life choices anymore. I mean, I think about, you know, when I was fucked up occasionally. But I mean, as far as my life today, I don't think about the choices that I've made because You know, ah we've had this guidance the past 14 and a half years or whatever. And so the choices I've made either I use, you know, one of the absolutes, the the program, the whatever the principles that we've been taught in this thing or.

00:11:27.44
Mike
run it by somebody. um And so I kind of i don't question them.

00:11:29.00
Bill
Right.

00:11:31.83
Mike
I mean, has everything turned out perfectly? Fuck no. oh But things are a hell of a lot better than they've ever been in my life before. So why the hell would I focus on that? Well, maybe if I would have done, fuck that.

00:11:44.33
Mike
No, it's again, I cannot waste any more time. I wasted decades of my life. I don't waste my time doing shit like that today. Um, you know, the choices I've made, where I'm at in my life today, I'm pretty okay with. And, you know, I, again, like the fucked up choices I made in my past when I was fucked up and didn't have these guard rails, guide rails, whatever. Um, you know, they, they have, we've talked about it plenty of times, those have meaning and and worth today too. So I don't question any of that shit anymore. I'm right where I'm supposed to be. Cause where the fuck else am I going to be? But right here.

00:12:23.09
Bill
Right. Well, and I was thinking about it as you were, you know, cause I do is I've gotten in kind of a habit of focusing a little bit on that action. Cause usually it's a, you know, again, it's an action.

00:12:33.49
Bill
It's a thing, you know, and an opportunity that usually for us to start off a conversation in that part of the reading, but it kind of crossed my mind. And I'm like, yeah it I didn't think about it in the way of like you said, I'll sit back and think about my life choices, but I mean, I don't really either, you know, I mean, it's the only time, again,

00:12:46.88
Mike
yeah

00:12:51.12
Mike
Oh,

00:12:51.28
Bill
I think I'd be, i well, I would be. I'd be a fucking liar to say that you know you don't have these waves of things that come across your your face and through your mind every once in a while, but that's just, it's just we're human.

00:12:57.59
Mike
of course.

00:13:01.69
Bill
These memories, it could be any reason in the world now to our point that we've talked about.

00:13:03.94
Mike
Right.

00:13:06.31
Bill
you know We don't dwell on those. But I mean, if the the cool part that I thought about when it said, I'll find somebody to confide in and and talk about what I'm feeling or doing, the first thing I thought about, I'm like,

00:13:14.00
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:13:18.45
Bill
that's what i do here you know um i mean literally it's i mean granted if there if there's something you and i have had clearly conversations outside of these fucking microphones over the last you know two and a half years or almost kind of coming up on three years

00:13:19.70
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:13:27.10
Mike
Mm hmm. Sure. Mm hmm.

00:13:33.71
Bill
um But you know in this timeframe, but for the most part, once again, 90% of the things that we got going on, we can talk about on here, even if it's slightly veiled, because we've done that too, you know and changing the names or whatever to protect the innocent, or those we just don't feel like fucking with at the time.

00:13:38.84
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:13:42.44
Mike
Yep.

00:13:46.53
Mike
Right. Of course. Right. To protect the innocent. Yes.

00:13:54.51
Mike
Right.

00:13:54.54
Bill
you know so but But yeah.

00:13:55.69
Mike
Or protect the guilty.

00:13:57.22
Bill
Yeah, that's you know, that's another goddamn good point. But so this has been that just goes back to everything we've talked about for the last two and a half years of of what a great outlet this this really is, you know, and in again, I mean, I talk about it all the time.

00:14:11.65
Bill
The number of people that we had listening a year ago, um you know, is was more than what it is now it it fluctuates a little bit, but we're We're not half, but maybe about half you know what it was, but we still got ah ah this core, literally this core of people, um whoever the fuck you guys are, thank you.

00:14:16.70
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:14:21.85
Mike
Right.

00:14:26.33
Mike
Right.

00:14:27.40
Bill
um you know And why you're still here, I don't know, but thank you again.

00:14:30.42
Mike
Right.

00:14:31.25
Bill
um Side note, tell somebody about it if this is.

00:14:34.31
Mike
right

00:14:35.20
Bill
if this means anything to you i wouldn't mind to have a couple of more years out there but that doesn't even fucking matter because the point is exactly what i was just saying is that we started this thing for us really to get together on a friday night and do exactly what we're still doing 142 episodes later and two and a half almost two coming up on three years later so there's my fucking action for the day i just said it

00:14:39.01
Mike
Sure. Yeah.

00:14:55.18
Mike
Right.

00:14:58.88
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Right. You know, I mean, for me, you know, a big part of the podcast is just, you know, this is, this is what it is kids, you know, early recovery, later recovery, whatever.

00:15:01.99
Bill
yeah

00:15:10.92
Mike
This is, this is fucking life, man. It's just a couple sober dudes get together and talking about our shit and discussing some sober stuff. But basically, you know, just being an example, you know, attraction rather than promotion, which, you know,

00:15:22.97
Bill
Right.

00:15:26.14
Mike
We try to promote a little bit but because this as we started off with this is not AA.

00:15:32.08
Bill
Right. Yeah, it is not. It is not even close. Well, its it could be it's AA adjacent. We talk about it.

00:15:37.83
Mike
Yes.

00:15:38.02
Bill
We're part of, but yeah, we're, we make it, uh, I'm just glad we decided never to do the fucking disclosures. Cause that still drives me nuts. When I, when I hear people saying that we're not mental health professionals, we're not doctors, we're not this.

00:15:49.27
Bill
And I'm like, did you have to tell me that really?

00:15:51.67
Mike
Yeah, right. I think clearly anyone that's listening to this knows we're none of those things.

00:15:54.31
Bill
and

00:15:57.37
Bill
yeah and you know if you if you choose to take our advice you know if you choose to take our suggestions you know so be it if it works out for you same thing i'll go back to that dude madison that dude that was called bear who was a big fucking burly biker and his thing all the time what he would when he would share in these discussion meetings

00:16:00.64
Mike
sentence Right.

00:16:09.53
Mike
Right.

00:16:13.75
Bill
at the end of every time that he shared like that he would say you know what that's my program it works for me um you may get drunk on my program i may get drunk on yours but this is what works for me and he would say that word for word every time and sometimes when i hear people repeat that shit or certain things that irritates me but that was comforting because i'm like i love this dude you'd look at him and he was scary as fuck even um even cleaned up you know

00:16:19.54
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:16:23.51
Mike
Oh, nice.

00:16:36.79
Mike
Right.

00:16:37.58
Bill
Um, but I mean, one of the most, uh, had probably 20 plus years sober and, um, lots of things to say, love to hear his own voice.

00:16:41.69
Mike
Sure.

00:16:44.75
Bill
You know, one of those guys, but at the end he was just saying, I don't know.

00:16:45.83
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:16:49.24
Bill
It's like, yeah, I w what the fuck do I know?

00:16:49.91
Mike
Hey,

00:16:51.72
Bill
You know, this is what works for me.

00:16:51.92
Mike
Right. Exactly. That's it. That's it, man. Right. This shit's working for me. I don't know. Right. Yeah. I don't know if it's going to work for you. Um, you fucking won't, but, but it's, you know, I'm sober and I'm happy and well ish and right.

00:17:04.64
Bill
Right. Yeah.

00:17:10.31
Bill
Right.

00:17:11.70
Mike
Yeah. You know, so fuck it. You know, I, I, my life is good. So it's clearly something's working. I think I'll, I think I'll keep doing it.

00:17:19.94
Bill
Right.

00:17:22.94
Bill
And, you know, a couple other things, I mean, obviously, again, talking about fear, which, you know, it it's still it's the it is it, you know, figuring out that that it's it lies behind everything, you know, in in our lives was a, you know, just an epiphany for me.

00:17:27.00
Mike
mm hmm. Right.

00:17:36.29
Bill
But, you know, the couple of things that said, you know, obviously, fear lives in our lives. I think I wrote God, I remember fear lives in our something. We're trained to be afraid, which that one, let me go back to that for a minute, or in a minute, but afraid of little things.

00:17:46.37
Mike
Right.

00:17:50.62
Bill
So that, um that one really kind of got to me too, only in the in the fact that thinking back, even now, I mean, I tend to I don't know if I tend to focus more on little things, but it's the little things that, it's the irritants that'll get to me more than the big events in some cases.

00:18:08.26
Mike
Sure.

00:18:09.64
Bill
Look, we even talked about, you know, the big deaths when mom died and stuff like that. Those are so, they're so blatant that, you know, that I got to watch myself. I got to be around people. We all got to come together type of thing, but it's these little things that fuck fuck with us and could fuck with us.

00:18:16.79
Mike
Right.

00:18:22.29
Bill
So, you know, being afraid of the the little, of the what ifs, the maybe this will happen, um all those sort of things. I could probably be, I'm probably more guilty of that still these days than anything else. it's Those little things I gotta watch out for. I mean, are you the same or no?

00:18:37.38
Mike
Um, yeah, definitely. Definitely. I mean, and it's, you know, the, what you said the what ifs, right?

00:18:42.99
Bill
Right.

00:18:43.16
Mike
Um, God, getting a fucking shovel full of that shit this week. Um, you know, whatever, don't have an opinion on any of it, but, um, yeah, definitely getting a lot of what ifs and you know, people afraid, man, um, people close to me afraid of what ifs right now.

00:19:02.06
Mike
And I'm just like, fuck, you know, and I can't, It's tough because, you know, i I want to be comforting because again, people I care about, but I also want to just shake them and go, but none of this has happened.

00:19:17.18
Mike
It's it's not reality right now. You know, it's one of the wonderful gifts of this program is. I live in the now, man. If it's not fucking going on, if it's going on, okay, fine, then I'll deal with that.

00:19:30.33
Mike
But if it's not, I'm not gonna think about it. I'm not gonna worry about it.

00:19:33.59
Bill
Thank

00:19:35.28
Mike
i'm not if it you know If and when something happens, then I'll deal with it.

00:19:37.75
Bill
you.

00:19:40.53
Mike
But if it hasn't happened yet, I'm not gonna worry about it. Because it might not, it might, it might not. But it's not happening right now. That's all I can focus on.

00:19:50.75
Bill
Right.

00:19:52.41
Mike
and I'm glad that's all I can focus on. Cause I'll fucking, yeah, I'll get all wound up about all kinds of shit that either has happened before or is about to happen, but it's not happening now. And I just, I, you know, take a look around. I've got to tell people all the time and I, I'm getting tired of saying it, you know?

00:20:16.15
Mike
Look around you. Is anything happening right now? No. Okay. Then stop fucking stressing about it. Cause it's not happening now. Nothing is, you know, or it's actually pretty good.

00:20:26.08
Bill
Right.

00:20:29.82
Mike
I'm comfortable. I have electric lighting and heat and you know, soft pillows, you know, running hot water. It's a fucking beautiful thing.

00:20:41.89
Mike
I'll think I'll focus on that shit.

00:20:43.95
Bill
Right? Yeah, and it's, ah I mean, we've we've talked about that too, that these these little things that i I could, I know for a fact, i I can what if myself into, if nothing else, a severe fucking panic attack, you know, or, you know, I mean, worst case scenario, if I keep what if, what if-ing myself, I'm gonna what if myself right out of this, you know, this fucking sobriety thing, because that goes back to, you know, it's one of the the next thing I wrote down, alcohol and drugs, ease the fears, you know?

00:20:57.03
Mike
Right. Mm hmm. Absolutely.

00:21:12.54
Bill
And you know what, i I thought of everything that you just said, I thought about, you know, kind of the, what, again, what's the the climate of things right now, you know, with people and, you know, again, abuse and alcohol and drugs and and that sort of thing.

00:21:16.58
Mike
Mm hmm. Hmm.

00:21:23.81
Bill
But, you know, the the whole point is it just, and yeah, that is a, um It's a it's a beautiful benefit of we get so many benefits from this whole sobriety thing and you know a program of of action that we're involved in and all those sort of things but um being able to literally just try to try to be and live where we are

00:21:34.53
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:21:46.84
Bill
it's It's not easy all the time, but um you know we've learned how to that, okay, all this fucking shit's going on over here, but I need to, again, the blinders on and look at this stuff.

00:21:46.83
Mike
listen No.

00:21:55.39
Bill
We've talked about that before and just say that, okay, yeah, right now at this moment, things are pretty fucking good.

00:22:00.36
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:00.62
Bill
I'm just gonna hang out and I'm gonna hang out and be me.

00:22:03.53
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:22:03.56
Bill
um And you know whatever happens tomorrow, fuck, you and I may ah drink tomorrow. We might be we might be dead tomorrow.

00:22:09.96
Mike
Right?

00:22:10.35
Bill
and nothing Nothing matters, it just doesn't matter. I almost went into a Metallica song rather than Bill Murray.

00:22:15.61
Mike
Right.

00:22:18.13
Bill
God damn it.

00:22:18.48
Mike
Ah.

00:22:18.57
Bill
I didn't want to do that. It just doesn't matter.

00:22:21.04
Mike
Right. You know, and clearly things do matter and, you know, take care of the people around you and whatever.

00:22:24.05
Bill
Right. No, I know.

00:22:26.33
Mike
But again, powerless over a whole bunch of shit. And I'm not going to, you know, I don't have those control issues anymore. If I can't control it, I'm not going to worry about it.

00:22:37.21
Mike
I'm going to worry about the shit I can control. and And that's all I can do. Again, that's, that's nice too.

00:22:42.15
Bill
Right.

00:22:45.07
Bill
Right, and then that that's you know kind of funny. The next thing I wrote down, pay attention to others, which is exactly what you just said and exactly what we try to do.

00:22:49.55
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:22:52.13
Bill
We need to try to be there for others, but um yeah, also try to, you know if nothing else, say, hey, you know what, it's things are okay right now. I get it.

00:22:58.77
Mike
Right.

00:22:59.41
Bill
you know shit Shit goes sideways. up'll I'll be right there with you to try to help you out.

00:23:02.00
Mike
Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

00:23:03.81
Bill
you know And that's that's ah the only other thing that, I don't know, I guess this is sideline to everything that's going on. But I mean, you know the two of us are you know two fucking white males in our mid fifty s you know we we don't um we are not part of that We are not part of what could be the affected groups.

00:23:15.00
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:23:24.20
Bill
you know

00:23:24.68
Mike
I've had that pointed out to me several times this week.

00:23:24.98
Bill
and

00:23:27.31
Bill
Oh, and i'm in and I'm fully aware of it, which is why, on half the time, I just keep my mouth shut, because i it's not my place.

00:23:29.56
Mike
Right.

00:23:32.20
Mike
Right. Oh, yeah.

00:23:33.69
Bill
It's not that I don't want to help or defend or do whatever, but ah i'm I'm a 56-year-old white boy living in the suburbs.

00:23:38.61
Mike
Right.

00:23:40.83
Bill
you know I mean, what the fuck do I know?

00:23:43.49
Mike
right

00:23:44.39
Bill
you know I mean, what what even when I travel, I'm a fucking 56-year-old white boy. yeah well say So I was in in the country hood for a couple of weeks.

00:23:52.03
Mike
Right.

00:23:53.32
Bill
yeah It's just fucking, but I'm in the middle of fucking violence. It's goddamn beautiful, you know?

00:23:57.63
Mike
right

00:23:57.97
Bill
um But I mean, again, we don't have the the problems that some of these perceived things could be. So part part of that, I get it, but I don't, you know, cause I, it's just not, I can't, I don't have that voice, you know?

00:24:03.79
Mike
Sure. Mm hmm.

00:24:10.92
Mike
Right, right.

00:24:11.13
Bill
I don't, you know?

00:24:12.58
Mike
But as a white, late 50s male, um I can certainly stand up for those people if somebody tries to fuck with them.

00:24:18.62
Bill
Oh God, yes.

00:24:20.03
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:24:20.13
Bill
Yeah.

00:24:20.93
Mike
So yeah.

00:24:21.13
Bill
And, and we, we've made that very, we've made that very clear. Yeah.

00:24:24.58
Mike
Uh huh.

00:24:25.01
Bill
I will, I'll stand up for fucking anyone. I mean, I, I will, I will live for as a people always say, you know, you say you die for your family, man.

00:24:26.92
Mike
Yup.

00:24:32.13
Bill
Would you live for them?

00:24:35.37
Bill
Yes, I would.

00:24:35.45
Mike
What moron said that?

00:24:37.42
Bill
I don't know. it's it's it's ah it's I can't believe you've ever seen that. Maybe it's just on Instagram, but they're always these, it's not a meme, but it's a post, all over the place, all the time.

00:24:40.81
Mike
Hmm.

00:24:46.61
Mike
Hmm.

00:24:47.06
Bill
You say you die for your family and friends. Would you live for them or would you get healthy for them? Would you get sober for them?

00:24:53.17
Mike
Ah.

00:24:53.73
Bill
And ah and I'm just like fucking Jesus Christ. you know It's just a goddamn saying, I would die for you means I'd do anything for you. Yeah, which would you live for them, man?

00:24:59.99
Mike
Right.

00:25:02.70
Mike
for Think I am.

00:25:04.12
Bill
Yeah, I do, I do, so.

00:25:05.14
Mike
Yeah, i'm I'm kind of not dying for them. Hi. How you doing? I want to be around to help you if I'm dead with the fuck I die for you.

00:25:10.68
Bill
Right? Yeah.

00:25:12.98
Mike
That's that's fucking stupid We did yep

00:25:15.84
Bill
Right, exactly. So, but anyhow, so I think we, ah yeah that was a slight opinion, but I think we may know, you know what, we had points, we made our points. How's that? But um no, I mean, the reading itself, and I do actually remember reading that because all these ones that are the fear-based readings lately, um

00:25:33.01
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:25:34.74
Bill
I am I'm paying a little bit more attention to them when they come up because Because of the fact that once again, it's a it was a fucking revelation for me realizing that every every issue every problem every anxiety every Everything that's wrong with me is fucking fear-based and that's not even an exaggeration.

00:25:37.11
Mike
Right.

00:25:42.01
Mike
Yeah.

00:25:49.30
Mike
Right.

00:25:51.35
Bill
That's a fucking fact Yeah, I hate it Right,

00:25:51.49
Mike
Right. Yeah, right. And and I mean, again, well, and and so if that's the case, then the whole point of doing this is to not be afraid.

00:26:02.40
Mike
Right. Be, be, be brave, be, be confident that there is a solution and we will find it, you know?

00:26:02.78
Bill
right

00:26:09.09
Mike
So, and we will. Yeah.

00:26:12.12
Bill
Exactly, exactly. So anything else on the reading? I mean, again, i the fear ones, i'm I'm really, really, I like readings in general, but these fear-based ones, um I don't know. they're I'm digging them.

00:26:22.53
Bill
I like them. I like them a lot.

00:26:23.26
Mike
Yeah. Right. Yeah, exactly. I mean, and again, well, it's a, that is the way of addiction. It likes us to be afraid.

00:26:31.33
Bill
Right.

00:26:31.48
Mike
Well, fuck I'm, I'm not in addiction anymore. So I'm not going to be fucking afraid.

00:26:36.56
Bill
Right. Yeah. And that is, I mean, everything, everything that we were caught in for fucking years was fear based.

00:26:42.27
Mike
here Right.

00:26:44.16
Bill
And then we drank over it. Then we got afraid that we drank over it. And then we fucked things up and then we drank over it.

00:26:46.99
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:26:49.06
Bill
and

00:26:49.48
Mike
So today I'll be brave. And if I see something that's wrong, I will try to fix it, making our little corner of the world a better place.

00:26:57.35
Bill
I made a point of, uh, of posting, posting that, uh, Canva picture a couple of times this week. I know I did it today or yesterday, but yeah, I just tried to hit that. Yeah. Our little corner of the world, our little corner of the world.

00:27:09.79
Mike
That's it.

00:27:10.27
Bill
It's all the fuck we can do.

00:27:10.38
Mike
That's all we have. Eddie. Right. I mean, what little control we have and it is very little, that is it right there in a nutshell.

00:27:16.46
Bill
Right.

00:27:18.99
Bill
Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. So anything else on the reading or real good?

00:27:23.44
Mike
Nah, I think we're good.

00:27:25.06
Bill
Okay. So there was a, it got kind of a weird comment that came through. Um, I get an email on it. It was a comment that was made on, uh, does anyone, do you even remember that we have a YouTube channel?

00:27:37.72
Mike
um I mean, like I suppose if it's brought up to me as it was just now, um I am aware of it.

00:27:42.84
Bill
Right.

00:27:44.95
Mike
I have certainly never been there, but I know it's out there somewhere. There's all kinds of shit floating out there on the interwebs.

00:27:49.91
Bill
Yeah.

00:27:52.36
Bill
there's Look up sober, not mature. we aren We're we pretty much everywhere. so yeah so And the only thing that is on our YouTube channel, um I'll say we, because I'll include you in this even though you you wouldn't do anything on it anyhow.

00:28:02.69
Mike
Mm hmm. Yeah.

00:28:05.39
Bill
And that's okay. I don't mean that in a bad way, I'm just saying.

00:28:06.49
Mike
Right. Right.

00:28:08.87
Bill
I don't do anything on it either. The the way I have our a podcast website set up is that it automatically posts each one of our web our episodes. Jesus fucking Christ.

00:28:18.06
Mike
Our webisodes, you ask, we have it.

00:28:21.48
Bill
you basically websiteed webisodes. But every one of our episodes gets automatically posted to um what is now X.

00:28:29.97
Mike
Hmm.

00:28:30.19
Bill
We have a have a Twitter account or X account, never do anything on that, but our episode links go on there um and they go on YouTube.

00:28:32.48
Mike
Hmm. No.

00:28:37.76
Bill
And all it is is our audio gets uploaded into there with, I think it's probably the, whatever the episode picture is.

00:28:39.95
Mike
Right.

00:28:44.11
Bill
So it's it's not video, we could do something.

00:28:45.02
Mike
Okay.

00:28:46.48
Bill
we i I don't know, whatever, it's there.

00:28:47.14
Mike
Sure. Hmm. Yeah.

00:28:49.41
Bill
So this, I get this message, yeah it does.

00:28:50.85
Mike
It exists.

00:28:53.11
Bill
So I get this message from this person and it says, it says for whatever reason YouTube suggested this to me, meaning obviously our our YouTube channel.

00:29:02.58
Mike
Okay.

00:29:03.63
Bill
And the guy says that um um having, he said that having beeps in your intro um could cause people not to listen past the first 30 seconds and that was it.

00:29:14.84
Bill
you know because the the intro that that I do, I separated all the points with the beeps, right?

00:29:16.73
Mike
Oh yeah. Right. Yeah, right. Yeah.

00:29:19.84
Bill
wi Which we, I think we put that, the beeps, God, was it right away? I don't remember, it might've been.

00:29:25.94
Mike
Yeah.

00:29:25.99
Bill
um Or pretty goddamn close to being in right away.

00:29:27.93
Mike
Right. You have first couple episodes, definitely.

00:29:30.64
Bill
And I think we might've had one of, one of our guests questioned it at one point, just saying that they didn't realize that we did that long lead into it. But, um, we've had a couple of people say they love it, at least when she first did the, um, the review of our podcast she thought it was funny as fuck.

00:29:41.51
Mike
Yeah.

00:29:44.05
Mike
All right.

00:29:44.84
Bill
So, um, I, I don't know. I mean, I was, I don't, it's the first person in all this time that's ever said it, but I wrote it down because anything like that.

00:29:52.06
Mike
Probably the first person that's ever heard it.

00:29:55.02
Bill
but Right, right. But, you know, ah the my first thing I was going to, because you can comment back, I'm like, that's all I commented back was that's an interesting thought. That's it. That's what I wanted to say is like, what the fuck are you talking about?

00:30:06.75
Mike
Right.

00:30:07.76
Bill
We've had it there for whatever, but you only get a certain number of characters, first of all.

00:30:09.03
Mike
right

00:30:11.04
Bill
But I was going to say, you realize there's a fast forward button, you know, I mean, whatever you go forward 10 seconds and anyhow.

00:30:14.65
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:30:18.04
Bill
but um i don't know if anyone is listening you know listen to our intro it give us your opinion i'd be i'd be interested if if people are irritated by it i don't really give a fuck if anyone listens to the intro anyhow if you don't if you as a listener don't like it again you can skip forward by 10 seconds on any one of the uh streaming apps i i know for a fact you can because i do it

00:30:29.77
Mike
Right. Sure. Right. Right. Yeah.

00:30:41.89
Bill
So yeah, if you don't like it forward through it, but I, I just be curious if anyone is actually really irritated by it. Um, I'm just interested, interested.

00:30:49.51
Mike
Hmm.

00:30:50.24
Bill
That's all I do too.

00:30:54.05
Mike
Did a heart monitor scare you at one point when you were a small child? What the fuck, man? I mean, right. I mean, I like them personally.

00:31:01.62
Bill
Yeah.

00:31:01.61
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:31:01.78
Bill
I do too.

00:31:02.35
Mike
I think that I, you know, yeah, it's just, um, I don't know. I find them pleasant. So there.

00:31:09.73
Bill
I know, it's just it it kind of blew my mind, but like again, anything like this, i I bring up to you because it is this is our time, Mr. Hand, and this is this is our podcast, so I figured I'd bring it up to you.

00:31:18.41
Mike
Right.

00:31:21.35
Bill
so yeah I don't know.

00:31:21.63
Mike
Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. Guy sounds like he's got some other issues he needs to work on.

00:31:27.46
Bill
Well, and the funniest part was YouTube rec...

00:31:28.78
Mike
Did the road runner scare you?

00:31:31.81
Bill
YouTube recommended this to me for some reason.

00:31:34.64
Mike
what ha

00:31:35.07
Bill
It was that sort of thing. And I'm like, well, in my head, I'm like, well, YouTube, at least YouTube's doing its job.

00:31:37.23
Mike
Okay.

00:31:39.43
Bill
They they recommended us to you.

00:31:40.39
Mike
All right.

00:31:41.09
Bill
So, so yeah, fuck you.

00:31:42.76
Mike
Yeah. Right. Why are you allowing some non-intelligent artificial intelligence to tell you what to do?

00:31:51.47
Bill
Yeah, and then find the need to comment on it, right?

00:31:53.51
Mike
Uh-huh. hi

00:31:55.33
Bill
All right, so um here's the here's the thing about the the podcast, and I just found this out, maybe it was last week, but I forgot to bring it up. um So there was a ah podcast that I've listened to, gosh, for a couple of years, because the way that I ah was introduced to this other podcast, and it's the the male and female podcast, the ones that took the the hiatus one time, the one that,

00:32:12.70
Mike
Right. Yeah. Yeah.

00:32:15.57
Bill
Yeah, and yeah, and I mean, I i do enjoy it.

00:32:15.62
Mike
You've talked about them.

00:32:18.34
Bill
and They usually put on an episode every Thursday. It was one of our listeners that recommended the podcast to me two years ago whenever they started.

00:32:24.04
Mike
Mm hmm. Okay.

00:32:27.16
Bill
So um usually it's Thursdays and a lot of times either I would listen to it that weekend or whatever the deal was and I didn't see a new episode and I waited. This was like back at the end of, shit, this might've even been while I was by you, um because it was over a month ago now.

00:32:38.68
Mike
and god

00:32:41.34
Bill
And then you know finally I clicked, I'm like, God, I haven't seen a new episode. Look, they had no new episodes. And I know that the one individual, one individual is on TikTok, one individual is only on Instagram now. um So I just popped, when I was on Instagram, I looked it up and I'm looking back and I'm trying to find anything about, you know if he put anything up there about the podcast.

00:32:59.39
Mike
Mhm.

00:32:59.69
Bill
And so he put this video and they used to always start off their podcast with, you know happy Thursday, welcome to. So that's how he opened up his his post.

00:33:08.49
Mike
Mhm.

00:33:08.84
Bill
And he says, ah he goes, blah, blah, blah. He goes, if you're wondering, it's not a podcast today. And he goes he goes, we decided to, he used the word, sunset the podcast.

00:33:18.94
Mike
Ah.

00:33:19.30
Bill
And I'm and i'm like, really? And then he said that um him and his co-host went to record that day. And I guess they were about to record. And they just looked at each other and like, yeah, we're done.

00:33:29.33
Mike
Hmm.

00:33:29.42
Bill
We have nothing nothing more to talk about. And he he's like, you know there's there's no drama. that you know we're We're friends or whatever. we just There's nothing else to talk about.

00:33:35.85
Mike
Right.

00:33:37.35
Bill
we've had with thousands of listeners and millions of downloads. And these are people that their TikTok followers were 200 a piece, like 200,000 each on TikTok.

00:33:47.08
Mike
Yeah.

00:33:47.82
Bill
And then he dumped um TikTok completely, and it's only on Instagram, a ton of followers on Instagram.

00:33:51.20
Mike
All

00:33:53.24
Bill
So they have the volume of people. So again, even if you got thousands of people, I could see, you know, he's saying they had millions of downloads, you know, and he's just, well, they had sponsorships and all these different, they're one of the ones that were doing a lot of the buy me a coffee and, you know, sustain our podcast.

00:33:54.96
Mike
right.

00:34:05.79
Mike
Well,

00:34:07.70
Bill
um you know And they were just fucking done. And I'm like, well, that sucks. you know And um so two things I talked about, and I don't really question, I thought about this from two different standpoints.

00:34:11.52
Mike
yeah.

00:34:18.03
Mike
Yeah.

00:34:19.94
Bill
They do whatever they wanna do. I'm not criticizing them for it.

00:34:22.53
Mike
Right.

00:34:22.66
Bill
I thought it was weird um because a lot of people, I was reading some of the comments, a lot of people were bummed out. They're like, man, I listened to you when I first got sober. You're part of my by week and this and that, kind of what that made me think about what we hopefully have nothing else are are trying to accomplish.

00:34:31.73
Mike
Yeah. Right.

00:34:36.94
Bill
but then I thought about it so from that standpoint, from a listener, but also from an early recovery type of thing, but then I thought about it from our side of things, you know? And I think, and but maybe correct me if I'm wrong, if let's let's just say when, cause I mean, I don't think we're going to be doing this to the to on our death beds, you know?

00:34:54.01
Mike
Hmm, probably not.

00:34:54.85
Bill
So whenever we decide to to shut this fucking thing down, I think we'll do a final episode, I think.

00:35:02.38
Mike
Oh, yeah, I would think so. Right? Yeah.

00:35:06.09
Bill
okay good good I just I don't want to hop on here one night you're just like yeah we're done we're not doing this anymore not you but um it would just seem fucking weird you know and and no that's there's no writing on the wall everywhere we're not we're not quitting I'm talking about somebody else we're we are not talking about

00:35:07.13
Mike
Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. Right. Yeah. No, no, no. We're talking about somebody else.

00:35:22.25
Bill
yeah Yeah, we're we're not talking this, is it?

00:35:22.91
Mike
fifty

00:35:24.24
Bill
No, forcast or foreshadowing.

00:35:26.44
Mike
Right.

00:35:26.75
Bill
um But, you know, I think the the only way that it might end, you know, I was thinking about this too, kind of in a sick way. The only way it might end up abruptly is if one of us fucking dies.

00:35:36.86
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. And well, and I would think I would hope that the other one would come on some, you know, I'd try to figure something out too. Right. Cause I mean, you do all the technical shit. I try to figure some way to get on here and let people know you're dead.

00:35:50.44
Mike
ah

00:35:52.32
Bill
Right, and you're not doing the podcast anymore because Bill's dead and I don't know how to do everything. so But um here just a side note for you, if I die and you don't know what to do, just get a hold of Elise.

00:35:57.58
Mike
Right.

00:36:05.01
Bill
She can put you back on the air. I know she can.

00:36:06.21
Mike
Ah, okay.

00:36:07.19
Bill
She can get you back can get you back up and running. I'm i'm sure she could.

00:36:08.94
Mike
Right. I mean, I would figure something out.

00:36:11.17
Bill
yeah

00:36:11.19
Mike
Great.

00:36:11.84
Bill
Right. So I mean, worst case, the sober curator could help you out. okay But am I in it?

00:36:15.29
Mike
Okay.

00:36:17.48
Bill
I guess I thought about that on your end, too. I mean, yeah. I mean you don't do i i knew you you'd figure it out. but I think this is what I'm going to do if it, God forbid. I mean, I'm just not wishing you dying or anything like that, but I'm just, just saying if it happens, um, you remember bewitched, right?

00:36:29.32
Mike
but I appreciate that.

00:36:35.49
Bill
You know, nobody does.

00:36:35.60
Mike
Uh, yes.

00:36:37.61
Bill
I'm sure that's listening to us based on our aid range.

00:36:39.17
Mike
ah hu

00:36:39.89
Bill
Some of them do, but remember when they, they just switched out Darren's and didn't tell anyone.

00:36:41.00
Mike
Right.

00:36:43.98
Mike
Oh yeah. Yeah. One Dick for another.

00:36:46.71
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. Dick Sargent is yeah.

00:36:47.56
Mike
Dick Sargent, Dick York.

00:36:49.48
Bill
It's a Dick York. So just.

00:36:50.44
Mike
Right. I actually, the other way. Yeah, yeah that's what I was. Sargent to York. Okay.

00:36:54.72
Bill
It was one one dick to the other. I like the way you put that to begin with.

00:36:57.56
Mike
Yes.

00:36:58.54
Bill
That worked that worked out well. So maybe i'll just you know I'll just hop on here and say, you know, hey. that Mike's dead, but here's Mike.

00:37:06.61
Mike
Here's my- Hi there!

00:37:09.36
Bill
It just, yeah. And it doesn't matter. It could be whether it's, whether it's another guy that I, you know, get, it get as a co-host or a chick, the person's name is going to be Mike.

00:37:14.07
Mike
Mm-hmm. Great.

00:37:17.56
Bill
Cause I don't want to go through, I get too much shit out on Canva and stuff like that. Everything says Mike and Bill. Um, maybe I could just blur out your picture and just randomly put some of the other picture in there.

00:37:26.30
Mike
Sure.

00:37:29.10
Mike
Right.

00:37:29.19
Bill
Um, I don't know, you know,

00:37:29.90
Mike
Well, Chris is really good at Photoshop, so, you know, she could help you out with that. You know, help her over her grief.

00:37:36.22
Bill
Yeah, I know your man just died, but hey, can you help me out with some Photoshop?

00:37:38.98
Mike
period

00:37:40.71
Bill
I don't wanna Photoshop out your man and and my my best friend.

00:37:40.75
Mike
a

00:37:43.99
Mike
Right.

00:37:45.78
Bill
Gotta get this podcast back on the air.

00:37:48.17
Mike
Right.

00:37:49.33
Bill
But no, it just it it on a serious note, it just did it kind of blew my mind a little bit, because what I thought about, and back to the to the driveway thing when we were talking about it, that that first post,

00:37:51.83
Mike
Yeah.

00:37:57.60
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:38:00.69
Bill
Wow. The first podcast that I listened to was called Recovery Happy Hour.

00:38:04.14
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:38:07.05
Mike
Right.

00:38:07.15
Bill
And her name is Tricia Lewis. And I only say all that stuff because she's very open with her name and all that stuff. At the time I started listening to her podcast, she had already done or it was right around the time that she had done her last episode.

00:38:20.74
Bill
So I knew it was done um at that time. And I remember and she because she just I listened to her.

00:38:23.42
Mike
Sure.

00:38:25.02
Bill
She was on the sober friends on Matt's podcast a few weeks ago or a month ago.

00:38:28.30
Mike
Okay.

00:38:30.16
Bill
um I think she did 138 episodes or whatever it was.

00:38:31.44
Mike
Okay.

00:38:33.69
Mike
okay

00:38:34.35
Bill
And um when she ended, and and I listened to them all in order, and I didn't jump through to listen why she why she quit, um but she just she came on and did a normal show, and then at the end of it, she dropped a fucking bomb and just said that, hey, here's what my deal is.

00:38:49.14
Bill
She goes, I'm too ah um to a point where um I'm big enough where I could do this full time if I wanted to. It takes some work. or I could go back and just, you know, kind of go into a different part of life and um shut this thing down.

00:39:00.60
Mike
Right.

00:39:01.91
Bill
Maybe I'll come back. Maybe I won't. But this is my last episode.

00:39:05.55
Mike
Huh?

00:39:05.65
Bill
My website is going to stay up. All my episodes are going to stay up. But she had a full explanation of why she did it, you know.

00:39:11.35
Mike
Right.

00:39:11.73
Bill
And, you know, a lot of people she was she started off, I mean, got an 18, 2017 or 18, something like that, I think could be wrong.

00:39:16.24
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:39:20.00
Bill
Um, but I mean, so she was one of the early ish ones from the sober podcast.

00:39:23.57
Mike
Sure.

00:39:23.90
Bill
Um, I did really well, had really, really well, but she decided to go in another direction. But, um, you know, again, I, I was kind of bummed out cause she was again, the, where I got my start with these sober podcasts.

00:39:28.90
Mike
Huh?

00:39:34.81
Mike
Right.

00:39:35.06
Bill
Um, but also literally she was the catalyst for, for this thing, you know, um, for this podcast, but, um, I don't know what just did it really, it just kind of.

00:39:38.34
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:39:45.12
Bill
It didn't even bother me. It just, it threw me a little bit that they were just like, we're not going to record it anymore. We're done.

00:39:50.77
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:39:51.59
Bill
You know?

00:39:52.30
Mike
yes Right.

00:39:53.03
Bill
So just weirdish, weirdish, but I know.

00:39:55.25
Mike
Yeah. Well, I mean, shit happens, you know. ah Right. I mean, you know, I've talked about the afternoon show I listened to here at the talk show here in Cleveland, the Alan Cox show.

00:40:06.06
Mike
um day He works for WMMS, which is a ah cheap channel. I mean, a clear channel. I mean, iHeartRadio, whatever the fuck it is now. um Yeah, and they did a bunch of major cutting last week and his two co-hosts were fired So yeah Yeah, so I mean they've been running best of all week and he's supposed to come back on live on Monday and It's gonna be weird because I mean the one the one guy who's been with him like 11 years and Yeah, he's gone

00:40:22.91
Bill
Really?

00:40:34.45
Bill
Wow.

00:40:37.79
Mike
So, you know, um, yeah, it's, yeah but that's, that's corporate and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And that, you know, nobody had any say in that.

00:40:44.66
Bill
Right.

00:40:47.53
Mike
That was the corporation saying, nope, we're not paying any more money for this show. Um, these people are gone and, um, yeah, so it's going to be weird, but I mean, yeah, this is, you know, nobody's telling us what the fuck to do.

00:41:01.41
Bill
Right.

00:41:01.56
Mike
So, you know, we're staying on until we don't want to anymore. And when we don't want to anymore, trust me, we're going to let you know.

00:41:08.67
Bill
Right.

00:41:09.27
Mike
Yeah.

00:41:09.37
Bill
Yeah. And that's just, ah and again, i'm I'm trying not to pass judgment and I'm not, I'm not meeting to pass judgment on, on them. My, my first thought was, yeah, you know, I, how could they do that? Blah, blah, blah. That's, that's, that's unfair.

00:41:20.28
Bill
It's, it's not my place or anyone's place to, to do it.

00:41:22.74
Mike
Right.

00:41:23.56
Bill
Um, you know, but yeah, they, I literally, I thought about her from too because it I was, I was an avid listener of their podcast and I did, I enjoyed it.

00:41:30.65
Mike
Right. Well, okay.

00:41:32.07
Bill
Um,

00:41:32.63
Mike
I'm going to, I'm going to go at it in another direction. Um, you know, we're fucking sober and we're supposed to have some sort of principles in our lives and we're not supposed to be selfish and self centered anymore, not completely.

00:41:35.37
Bill
okay.

00:41:44.76
Mike
And, um, yeah, you know, we get on here and we bramble and we talk about whatever, but I know that there are people out there that listen and listen fairly regularly.

00:41:54.88
Mike
And, you know, I, as a listener,

00:41:55.30
Bill
Right.

00:41:57.80
Mike
of podcast radio shows and programs and whatever programs

00:41:59.74
Bill
Stories.

00:42:02.07
Mike
um Right. but Exactly. You know, um you build a relationship with these people that you don't know. and okay And yeah, I mean, to do that is, I think, pretty fucking shitty, quite frankly, and especially for a sober podcast.

00:42:19.98
Mike
I mean, if it's about, you know, ah Joe Rogan does it or something, who fucking cares?

00:42:24.89
Bill
right

00:42:24.90
Mike
He's an asshole. why um But again, people enjoy him and and that would be, he just fucking disappears, would be weird and unfair to the people that have committed at the time to, you know, whatever, spend a little of their lives listening to what you do.

00:42:41.62
Mike
That, that means something to me.

00:42:41.67
Bill
Right.

00:42:43.62
Mike
You know, um yeah, there's no way in hell I'd just fucking disappear. I mean, if I you know if i don't wanna do this anymore, I'm gonna let you know why and I'm gonna let you know when I'm gonna stop doing it because I appreciate and and and understand as a listener to other shows what it means to listen to a show regularly.

00:42:55.23
Bill
Right.

00:43:04.62
Mike
So yeah, I don't know. i just I think it's kind of selfish and shitty and I will judge them, fuck them.

00:43:11.61
Bill
You know what, and that's a, I couldn't figure out what, cause like I said, I was, and I felt like I was kind of wishy washy on it cause I couldn't figure out exactly how I felt, but that's a good point, you know, is I was thinking about it from, again, the we would do that and the listeners and, but that, that is a good point.

00:43:21.58
Mike
Mm.

00:43:27.85
Mike
But why wouldn't we do that?

00:43:27.91
Bill
Maybe, maybe. Well, and that's, that's my, that's my point.

00:43:30.66
Mike
That's why what I just talked about, right?

00:43:32.64
Bill
And I, I wasn't, I wasn't, it was there, but I wasn't realizing that that's what was, that's what I was feeling. So yeah, you're, you're exactly right. It just, it it goes outside of what we were taught to just all of a sudden stop, you know?

00:43:43.88
Mike
Mm hmm. Yeah, right. Yeah. Well, I mean, if we've learned anything, don't fucking stop.

00:43:51.99
Bill
Yeah.

00:43:52.05
Mike
Um, and you know, and if you're going to change, you know, uh, and it's going to affect someone else, you need to let them know why. Yeah. You know, I mean, that's, again, you know, principles, man, you know, practice these things in all of our affairs.

00:44:05.61
Bill
Right.

00:44:07.94
Mike
Well, this is one of our affairs. So I'm going to practice that shit that I was taught, you know, right. It's not all about me. If I need to change something in my life and it's going to affect you, I'm going to explain why I need to do it.

00:44:22.24
Bill
Right.

00:44:22.46
Mike
You know, yeah, you know, I mean, and then it's up to you to, you know, you can be pissed or sad or, fucking happy that I'm not around anymore. you know that But that's on you. i'm gonna My side of the street's going to be clean, because I'm going to explain to you exactly why I'm doing it.

00:44:37.79
Bill
Right. So if we decide to like, I don't know, bring a monkey on as part of the show, we don't necessarily, we don't necessarily have to, we don't necessarily have to explain that.

00:44:42.14
Mike
yeah ha We're getting a monkey? Fucking cool.

00:44:49.61
Bill
We just all, one day we're just going to have a fucking monkey.

00:44:51.08
Mike
Well, yeah. oh yeah Can we spank it?

00:44:55.91
Bill
Yeah, that's what I mean. yeah I'll never forget. This has nothing to do with spanking, but we're early, early kind of, I think it was in the first year we were talking about, um again, this whole idea of the things that, you know, telling people we got to do these certain things because of our sobriety.

00:45:00.47
Mike
yeah

00:45:11.12
Bill
And then, you know, I said, I said, that could be, you know, I remember thinking to myself, you know, I could use that, you know, for evil rather than good.

00:45:17.86
Mike
easy

00:45:18.16
Bill
And then you started making a joke. You're like, you're like yeah, you can just do whatever you like. You're like, you could bring a goat to Christmas. You told me to bring a goat to Christmas, put a fedora on his head, wrap up, tie a big book around his neck and call him Bill.

00:45:31.98
Mike
yeah yeah

00:45:33.94
Bill
And I'm sure you don't remember that, but you was see it was fucking great.

00:45:35.59
Mike
I don't. That's good though. I like it.

00:45:39.45
Bill
And you're like yeah like, it doesn't matter. People can't say anything because you can just say it. This keeps me sober.

00:45:45.83
Mike
That's right. This is my emotional support goat, Bill.

00:45:48.93
Bill
Yeah, but yeah, you said, again, a goat, a fedora, and again, to tie a big, I think, around his neck.

00:45:53.92
Mike
Tie a big booger. Wow. Wow. What the fuck is wrong with me? but

00:46:01.58
Bill
ah You know what? Fucking nothing, because that's, dude, that dude that was 13 and a half years ago, probably, and I'll never fucking forget it. It was so fucking funny. It was so fucking funny, so.

00:46:12.31
Mike
Oh, nice. God damn. I like that.

00:46:15.56
Bill
That might have actually been,

00:46:15.79
Mike
um I'm all right.

00:46:17.85
Bill
you know what come to think of it that might have been 14 years ago because we might have been going going into our first our first holidays because it would have been before thanksgiving and you know i should i think that was because i think that's yeah because you didn't come to christmas until the second year um in thanksgiving no you didn't do thanksgiving because i did yeah that was the dry thanksgiving we did um in moms but uh yeah it might have literally 14 years ago you had that beautiful and wonderful thought

00:46:21.33
Mike
Wow.

00:46:25.97
Mike
Right.

00:46:30.69
Mike
right Right. Yeah, right.

00:46:44.79
Mike
Wow.

00:46:46.01
Bill
Yeah, but no, I just had kind of tears in my eyes. I get thinking about it. You had just fucking walk into the house. Could you imagine that walking into John and Gail's house?

00:46:54.29
Mike
these things things

00:46:54.84
Bill
My aunt and uncle had this, they they lived in what looked like the home alone house. you know as my My uncle was an attorney and did very well for himself.

00:46:59.25
Mike
Yeah.

00:47:02.28
Bill
And they did, they lived in a home alone house.

00:47:04.64
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:47:04.84
Bill
um And it was it was was nicely done. And you know again, ah my my aunt very particular and yeah.

00:47:08.83
Mike
Oh, yeah. Oh God, it was a beautiful house, yeah. I mean, you know, built in the 20s, about a block off the lake in Lakewood.

00:47:16.15
Bill
Yeah.

00:47:16.37
Mike
Yeah, it was fucking great. I love that place.

00:47:18.33
Bill
Yeah. And then yeah i I come strolling in with a fucking goat with a fedora and a big book around his neck.

00:47:24.37
Mike
Yup. hit

00:47:27.27
Bill
ah I want to go back and do that now. I either suggest it to somebody, so.

00:47:31.35
Mike
I know, I gotta look up rent a goat.

00:47:35.65
Bill
You know what? here There's a business idea. We have an LLC. Oh shit.

00:47:41.31
Mike
I do need a goat.

00:47:46.50
Mike
You know, I think on that note, we need to take a break.

00:47:48.41
Bill
I do too.

00:47:50.34
Mike
Speaking of sponsorships and commercials, we'll be right back with more goat talk right after these words from our sponsors.

00:48:05.83
Bill
All right everyone, welcome back.

00:48:10.49
Bill
And I'll tell you what, if I will give you, I will owe you $5 right now if you have another relevant goat story, go. Because you said more goat talk, so go.

00:48:19.33
Mike
Oh God. that Um, nope, nope, nope.

00:48:20.74
Bill
hey

00:48:23.93
Bill
That took too long, took too long. Well, okay, you'll ask you lost, you just lost $5 there.

00:48:30.03
Mike
That's fine. Well spent.

00:48:32.11
Bill
Exactly. So, want to hear about drunk animals? I mean, this doesn't...

00:48:35.92
Mike
Wow. We have a theme going.

00:48:37.17
Bill
You know what? I didn't even plan that because I didn't plan on having a flashback to fucking sobriety with my emotional support goat.

00:48:48.31
Bill
But there was, again, the morning show, they were talking about, in its fermented fruit, they were talking about animals getting drunk on fermented fruit.

00:48:56.24
Mike
Ah, yes.

00:48:57.36
Bill
So, I've heard about this before, but first of all, the website that the article, because I looked it up, the website is boingboing.net.

00:49:02.39
Mike
Hmm.

00:49:08.34
Bill
So B-O-I-N-G, B-O-I-N-G, fucking boingboing. Can you imagine? Don't visit us at boingboing.net. So anyhow, um fermented fruit. I think we've we've actually even talked about that on here, but here's what I didn't know. It said, flour and plants begin producing nectar in fruits that could be fermented by yeast. In tropical climates, fruit can reach surprisingly high alcohol levels up to, and I won't go to let you guess, um alcohol by volume in some cases. What do you think it can reach up to, the higher levels? so Percentage.

00:49:42.85
Mike
but Um, I don't know. I would think like 35, 40.

00:49:49.54
Bill
that That would be a strong fruit. They said 10.2, which still I thought was, I thought was, I mean, that's, that's impressive itself biting into a fruit 10%.

00:49:51.22
Mike
Yeah. and Okay.

00:49:58.74
Bill
I mean, that's a, they were talking about it on the radio. They're like, they're like, that's a strong IPA. And the news lady's like, she's like, that's like a bottle of wine.

00:50:03.22
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:07.69
Bill
I'm like, what's in wine? And I'm like, Jesus Christ. But that's the thing that the the the story itself didn't really get, you know, kind of like grab me, but the alcohol percentage did because we've, I think everyone's heard about the whole fermented fruit thing, but um I mean, 10%, that just, that kind of that kind of blew my mind.

00:50:20.98
Mike
Sure.

00:50:23.48
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:24.85
Bill
i Did you have any clue that it would be that high? Well, clearly you said 40%.

00:50:28.10
Mike
ba Yeah. I said, yeah, right. Yeah. I was telling wishful thinking. I'm still an alcoholic, folks.

00:50:36.68
Bill
Right, you know what's it what it reminded me of though? Our our good friend, our good friend Bob, that said that you had to change your sobriety date if you happen to eat a piece of bad fruit.

00:50:42.24
Mike
ahha

00:50:46.05
Bill
You remember that when we were in the three quarter house? And I'm like, how are you fucking idiot? And I'm just like, you know, no, that's that's not that's not how that the sun fucking works, you know? But um I don't know, that had to, again, had nothing really to do with anything but the 10% clearly didn't surprise you because you said 40.

00:51:03.91
Mike
Right. Again, I'm the come fucking drunk, man. I always will be.

00:51:07.65
Bill
All right, let's get to some of the things that I wrote down. I think I wrote down some some poignant things. um This one might've been from today, from Keep It Simple. All mistakes in life are gifts. Yes, no, or do you agree or disagree?

00:51:27.38
Mike
all All mistakes.

00:51:29.43
Bill
All mistakes in life are gifts.

00:51:32.12
Mike
Well, if you look at them that way, if you turn them into gifts, yeah, absolutely. Right.

00:51:36.89
Bill
turned that frown upside down.

00:51:38.87
Mike
That's right. Um, yeah, of course. Yeah. they would If you're doing it right. Absolutely. Yeah. Why wouldn't they be, you know, again, yeah back to the fear shit, you know, we fear those mistakes.

00:51:52.29
Mike
You know, I'm not afraid to fail today because of this program. Um, I, I, yes, I learned from my failures and, um, That's why I'm not afraid to anymore.

00:52:04.39
Mike
um I used to be scared to death of failing. That's why I didn't fucking do anything. If you don't try, you don't do anything. You can't fail.

00:52:12.16
Bill
Right.

00:52:12.15
Mike
I'm sitting here. I'm not failing. Look, I'm not failing. Yay. ah I'm not doing any goddamn thing at all, but I'm not failing. um It's kind of like the Browns aren't gonna lose this week.

00:52:23.94
Mike
They have a bye week.

00:52:25.06
Bill
Yeah, so so do the Packers, surprisingly.

00:52:26.81
Mike
Right. Ah, well, so there you go. The Browns and the Packers will not lose this week. Um, that is the same, same concept. They're not going to do anything. So they can't fail. Um, right.

00:52:40.02
Mike
Yeah, absolutely. Yes. My mistakes are gifts, you know, um, not to anybody else, but, um, but to me, yeah. As long as I don't continue to repeat them and and I learned my lesson from them.

00:52:50.30
Bill
Right.

00:52:52.85
Mike
Yeah, of course. Yeah. Makes sense to me.

00:52:56.02
Bill
Well, and that's the thing that I mean, long before this whole sober thing, you know, I always hear, you know, you got to learn from your mistakes and blah, blah, blah.

00:53:03.51
Mike
Right.

00:53:04.18
Bill
And, you know, I mean, before we have clearer heads, I mean, I know I never wanted to hear that. And I'm like, well, fuck, fuck that.

00:53:09.14
Mike
Right.

00:53:10.38
Bill
That's not so fun to that.

00:53:12.14
Mike
No, I'm perfect.

00:53:12.54
Bill
You know, but.

00:53:13.07
Mike
I don't make mistakes.

00:53:15.63
Bill
But the other thing too, you know, that ah yeah you hear, you've I'm sure you've heard the saying that, you know, a mistake that's either repeated or a mistake, quote unquote, that happens more than once is a choice, you know, if you're, then if you're not learning from them, you know, so like you you said, you said that earlier, and we've said it in in a ton of different um episodes, you know, as far as the the, the shit that we went through and the mistakes that we made, um all those things have worth, you know,

00:53:25.94
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:53:39.03
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:53:41.93
Bill
and all of them do if we, like you said, the key though is is learning from them.

00:53:44.71
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:53:45.97
Bill
Are you gonna keep repeating that same thing over and over? Well, it's like, oh, it wasn't that bad the last time.

00:53:50.43
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:53:52.88
Bill
whatever Whatever it is, and usually it is trying to, you know, I think I'm gonna control my drinking or using. you know but um yeah learning learning from our mistakes. just It was such a simple statement.

00:54:04.25
Bill
So I'm like, you know i I don't know, something to talk about, but I do, I agree. you know I mean, I don't like, I don't think anyone anyone necessarily looks for making mistakes, but you can look at it the yeah flip again, flip it the other way around.

00:54:13.78
Mike
Now.

00:54:17.22
Bill
um I know I'm gonna make mistakes, but there's there's no fucking way in the world I'm gonna learn if I don't make mistakes.

00:54:18.76
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:54:23.41
Bill
because i Like you said, we, unbeknownst as much as everyone might think we're perfect, we're not.

00:54:23.74
Mike
Right.

00:54:31.57
Mike
Who is everyone?

00:54:33.60
Bill
yeah every Everyone, at least we didn't shut down our podcast and just not record.

00:54:35.32
Mike
All right.

00:54:38.18
Bill
Hello, that's going to be that's a new standard.

00:54:39.22
Mike
Hey.

00:54:40.88
Bill
As long as we show up every week, we're we're better than at least some.

00:54:44.74
Mike
Well, yeah, that ah taught us that real early on, man. Just fucking show up, man. The rest of it will take care of itself.

00:54:50.28
Bill
Right. Exactly. So, um, the other thing, and this was just as I was, as I was doing my readings, um, one of the days this week. So when you sit down to do your, your readings, your prayers, blah, blah, blah, are you completely focused during that timeframe?

00:55:06.86
Bill
Or, um, I mean, like do other thoughts flow through your head? Do you ever, I mean, like do something else or be like, Oh, I gotta, I almost forgot. I gotta do this or, or that, that sort of thing.

00:55:17.24
Mike
sometimes.

00:55:18.29
Bill
Yeah.

00:55:18.41
Mike
Yeah, you know, yeah, definitely. You know, I mean, I'll be sitting there, laying there. Cause I usually lay down, get up, take a piss, grab my books, lay back down in bed and read them. Um,

00:55:29.50
Mike
And um yeah, you know, I mean, I'll be sitting there and reading the words and thinking about what I have to do that day. of Sometimes, you know, not all the time, and out sometimes I catch myself doing it and go, okay, asshole, pay attention to what you're doing here for your 10 minutes. You know, you'll get to the rest of the day when you get to it.

00:55:50.58
Bill
Right.

00:55:50.66
Mike
Um, again, that living in the now thing, I'm not fucking perfect at it either. You know, I just, I try cause it's easier. Um, but, oh yeah, definitely. You know, my mind wanders, it wanders all over the goddamn place.

00:56:05.67
Bill
Yeah, it is. it's ah it's It's difficult. I can't remember what what day it was, but like two or three things popped into my head while I was doing the readings. And one, it's like something that I had to do and I'm like, ah, fuck it.

00:56:16.75
Bill
So i I popped out of my reading and made myself a note and then something else I'm like, fuck, I remember that. I like got up and grabbed something, you know? And it was like really just one of those days when I was distracted two, three times and it was just out of the ordinary.

00:56:27.99
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:56:29.38
Bill
So I wrote it down, but um yeah, there are certain times when, you know, i've

00:56:31.07
Mike
Right.

00:56:34.00
Bill
ah I don't know if it's always been at night, probably more so at night, where I've done my prayers and I'm like, God, I didn't even focus on that. Hasn't been many times, but there's been a couple of times when i've I've said them again, because I'm like, I got nothing out of what I just said.

00:56:49.38
Bill
yeah

00:56:49.87
Mike
Right.

00:56:50.52
Bill
you know And I'm like, I need to fucking focus on this stuff. I need to not just recite the words that go through the motions. Although once again, I mean, I know that the things that we do, the taking the action is is one of the main things, if not the main thing.

00:57:03.85
Mike
Mm hmm. Great.

00:57:05.60
Bill
um But in in a lot of these things, therere I know the words are are sticking in there at least bit by bit. And you know every year when I read these things, more and more of it probably gels in my head.

00:57:16.84
Bill
Maybe that's why I get these you know these fucking light bulb moments.

00:57:18.65
Mike
Oh, yeah.

00:57:19.56
Bill
But um it is, it's it's hard sometimes to just sit and focus.

00:57:22.74
Mike
Well, I mean, and yeah, and you got to remember where, you know, over 5,000 times of doing this every day, one day at a time.

00:57:31.08
Bill
yeah

00:57:31.28
Mike
Um, so, you know, yeah, and not every one of them is going to be super focused and super fucking you know fruitful. Um, you know, it's not, it's just not, you know, um, but you know, again,

00:57:44.84
Mike
Like you said, man, going through the motions and doing the action, even if your heart and your brain and your soul and your what fucking ever isn't completely into it, we're still doing it.

00:57:55.60
Mike
And apparently we're still getting the results.

00:57:58.92
Bill
right

00:57:59.58
Mike
You know, right. And and again, and and then having the knowledge, the self knowledge of going, ah, shit, I kind of did that half-assed. Maybe I, uh, you know, maybe I should do it again.

00:58:09.26
Bill
Right. Maybe you gotta and maybe got to throw my whole ass into it this time.

00:58:10.20
Mike
Nothing wrong with that.

00:58:14.21
Mike
Right. and At least three quarters of it.

00:58:17.06
Bill
But it's even even with listening, listening to these audio books. Oh, I gotta tell you about Al Pacino.

00:58:21.74
Mike
Hmm.

00:58:22.56
Bill
um Listening to these audio books in the car. you know because i'm And I am, I'm focused on driving and I'm listening.

00:58:27.68
Mike
Sure.

00:58:28.45
Bill
And again, taking in information, but there, shit, there's been times with either the audio books or even podcasts. where I'll again, the same thing as I said, if people don't like the fucking beeps on ours, you know, roll 10 seconds ahead or whatever it is, you can do the same thing backwards, obviously in a podcast.

00:58:40.52
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:58:42.78
Bill
So I've gone back and re listened to a part because I know I ah just spaced, you know, I wasn't listening to it.

00:58:46.00
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

00:58:49.49
Bill
But um yeah, it just, it is, it's ah it's its strange how the, I don't know, at least how my brain works in a lot, and I know a lot of people are too, I'm not unique in that in that fashion, but um I mean the, you know, the readings of my prayers are important to me, you know, and I, um when I when i so stray from that sometimes, it doesn't, again, doesn't really bother me, but yeah, every once in a while I'm like, okay, listen motherfucker, read that again, and I will, I'll do the i'll do the reading again, because I know I didn't, I know I didn't read the fucking thing, I did, but I didn't, you know?

00:58:58.56
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:59:12.96
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:59:17.45
Mike
Right. Yeah. Right. Now happens to all of us.

00:59:21.81
Bill
even the best of us, right?

00:59:22.88
Mike
Hmm. Even the worst of us.

00:59:25.69
Bill
So um I was actually just, speaking of being distracted, I do, I listen to you while you talk, but I also kind of scan for other things to, for the next thing to try to keep it flowing.

00:59:31.74
Mike
Hmm.

00:59:36.74
Bill
So it kind of, cause sometimes, you know, I want to feel a little, a feel a little bit professional with this stuff.

00:59:40.75
Mike
if All right.

00:59:42.11
Bill
So rather than going, what should we talk about next?

00:59:47.23
Mike
Right.

00:59:48.33
Bill
So the the one I found, this is,

00:59:49.25
Mike
What should we talk about next?

00:59:50.82
Bill
I have one.

00:59:52.05
Mike
Ah.

00:59:52.19
Bill
um This is from a bit ago, I think from God grant me, um help me learn to enjoy reading ah as a way to tap into the wisdom of the ages.

00:59:59.58
Mike
ah

01:00:02.92
Bill
Okay, so what I put in parentheses, though, which ah and I guess what I was thinking about at the time, when is the last time that you read anything out of the big book?

01:00:15.06
Bill
I knew that'd be a good one.

01:00:16.42
Mike
Uh-huh. Um, other than quotes out of the big book and the meditation readings, uh, it's been, well, probably, uh, nine months.

01:00:29.90
Mike
Uh, yeah, you know, I was, uh, some idiot asked me to sponsor them. And so we were doing some work. Um, yeah, you know, I mean, seriously, it's the only time I cracked a big book anymore is, um,

01:00:42.80
Bill
Right.

01:00:43.59
Mike
Yeah. If I'm trying to help somebody else, show somebody else something. Um, well, that's the honest answer. Yes.

01:00:50.03
Bill
Right.

01:00:50.14
Mike
I should, you know, I mean, I get the flashes occasionally, you know, you really ought to go down there and pick up that fucking book and read something out of it. Uh, and then I don't, um, right.

01:01:01.45
Mike
You know, again, but that's, you know, unless I'm 12 stepping with someone, i I don't for myself anymore.

01:01:07.83
Bill
Right.

01:01:08.43
Mike
Yeah. How about you, Bill?

01:01:09.24
Bill
and they

01:01:11.22
Mike
yeah

01:01:11.59
Bill
um You know, i maybe in and closer, maybe it was sooner than night. Maybe it wasn't as far back as nine months ago, but it wasn't to read a lot.

01:01:20.50
Mike
All right.

01:01:21.80
Bill
It was to look up something that either we were talking about or something I thought about, you know, that led that we were going to talk about.

01:01:28.58
Mike
Okay.

01:01:28.77
Bill
And i I knew it was in the big book. So I because I've got it. My sobriety app is a big book is a big book app.

01:01:33.74
Mike
Great. Right.

01:01:34.79
Bill
So, and I could search, you know, for words. So I think that's probably the last thing I did and I would have read, um, you know, a section.

01:01:36.92
Mike
Right.

01:01:41.14
Bill
There was one of the readings not too long ago, last couple of months, it's like read whatever page of, and I went to, or like it says in whatever page somewhere, I ran across that probably in one of the readings.

01:01:41.27
Mike
right

01:01:50.52
Mike
Right.

01:01:50.66
Bill
So I'm like, Oh, I'm going to do that. And I'm like, ah, if I could read this plenty of times, I'm like, I'm good.

01:01:53.53
Mike
few assistance Right.

01:01:54.18
Bill
Which is so stupid, you know? but probably in shit now maybe it was I know I was in German town so handful of years ago maybe I got in this I got in my mind I'm like okay every night I'm gonna sit down and I'm just gonna read either from one of the stories or one of the chapters um just kind of read through some of this stuff you know a few pages this and that and I think I did that for about three nights

01:02:14.41
Mike
Right.

01:02:19.56
Mike
Yeah. Uh-huh.

01:02:21.47
Bill
you know, so probably, and I'm like, I'm only gonna do, you know, 15, 20 minutes. So I think I probably read about 45 minutes of the big book, you know, total um handful of pages here and there, you know, probably 15 pages, um seven years ago.

01:02:31.07
Mike
All right. There you go.

01:02:36.93
Bill
you know and uh again it's just same deal and it's i i bring my my big book is in my car my big book and the 12 and 12 are in the car but i brought them more for this than i did for um personal consumption i guess if that's the right way to put it

01:02:42.69
Mike
Right.

01:02:51.61
Mike
Right.

01:02:52.59
Bill
because every once in a while we talked about something for the 12 and 12, we were doing the, you know, obviously went through the steps. At some point I do, I wanna go through the all the different little bookmarks and notes and shit like that I had in the big book.

01:03:04.97
Bill
I know I read off a couple of them from time to time, but it's fun to look at those every once in a while.

01:03:08.92
Mike
Right.

01:03:09.23
Bill
But I mean, it's in by so my fucking card, the book, not my app, my real book, you know?

01:03:13.85
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:03:15.05
Bill
And um that's where it sits.

01:03:16.89
Mike
Yeah, right. I mean, you know, well, mine's on my bookshelf downstairs and you know, right with all my other recovery books. Um, yeah. And I've actually, and I keep a mini one in the truck at all times, just in case, case of emergency break glass.

01:03:30.00
Bill
Yeah.

01:03:34.36
Mike
Um, yeah, you know, I've got one of the little ones.

01:03:35.67
Bill
Right.

01:03:36.66
Mike
It's just the first 164 pages. None of the stories. Um, And, uh, yeah, you know, just in case, you know, um, in case I need it or more importantly, in case somebody around me needs it, somebody walks up to me and says, Hey man, you know, I see you got that little circle triangle on the back of your truck there.

01:03:57.46
Mike
I have a question. All right. Well, I may have an answer and in case I don't have it in my head, I have it on paper.

01:04:05.70
Bill
Right.

01:04:06.44
Mike
Yeah.

01:04:07.43
Bill
You know, the, in one of the reasons, um, and I, I paid for that big book app and that was the story of, you know, again, I was spending God knows how much on fucking games and music and download all this shit.

01:04:18.22
Mike
Right.

01:04:19.89
Bill
And I, I wanted to get a sobriety app and I'm like, Oh, that'd be kind of fun. They had the big book because the, and um I think I've said this before, but the reason I got this particular sobriety app and big book app, there's a ton of them out there, but this one lines up with the actual pages of the fourth edition.

01:04:27.52
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:04:35.51
Mike
Right.

01:04:35.58
Bill
you know so and my thought was okay if I'm in a meeting and because I've been to meetings before it's a big book meeting they they do they run out of books you know and um I'm like if they're like okay we're gonna start on page 132 and start our reading tonight I can go in my app and go to 132 and I'll literally be on the correct page but it was six dollars you know and I'm like I'm not fucking so I remember telling you

01:04:42.85
Mike
Right.

01:04:52.60
Mike
Mm hmm. Ooh.

01:04:59.47
Mike
Right.

01:04:59.89
Bill
We're at the three quarter house and I'm like, I've got to spend fucking, why would I want to spend fucking $6 on a goddamn app?

01:05:01.09
Mike
Yeah.

01:05:04.40
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:05:05.33
Bill
And then I think I came back to you like two minutes later. I'm like, you know what? I just had a realization, and you know, getting the games of fucking, you know, angry birds and everything else I was fucking buying.

01:05:09.75
Mike
hey

01:05:15.17
Bill
and but it's It's a one-time payment. I've had it for 12 years, you know probably 13 years, um but it's great.

01:05:18.69
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:05:22.06
Bill
I love it. just I like the Sprite account. or It's simple, but um I do. If i I ever need to look something up, i mean it's really easy to get to it.

01:05:29.48
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:05:29.54
Bill
I don't think it's got the stories in in the app. I think it's just the first 164, I think.

01:05:34.41
Mike
Right.

01:05:35.05
Bill
I don't recall.

01:05:35.28
Mike
ahh

01:05:35.52
Bill
but Yeah, so I was just curious. I wrote that down, and I don't know how long ago it was, that i and I knew I hadn't wrote anything out of the book. I hadn't thought you did, and but you know, nine months, that's really not that long ago.

01:05:46.18
Mike
Right. it It's not like it was yesterday.

01:05:49.51
Bill
And it's not seven, it's not seven years ago either, so, you know.

01:05:49.84
Mike
Certainly not today. No.

01:05:55.06
Bill
All right, so, oh fuck, where did that one just go? It just had.

01:05:58.53
Mike
hey So much for professionalism.

01:06:02.34
Bill
Yeah, it's just weird, ah that I'll come back to it. I think I, you know, i Oh yeah. and No, no, no, no, I actually have it here. um Do you ever feel stale or stagnant with your meeting routine? And again, I know you go to the one meeting um or even take a side that just the fact that you do the one meeting now over the years, did you ever feel stagnant in your meeting routine? Maybe when you were going to more meetings on a regular basis at any point that you ever feel that way?

01:06:32.62
Mike
I mean, i yeah, ah you know i I probably do now. um you know it But um i the I don't know if the right word is stagnant. um I mean, it's certainly routine. i I certainly know I could do more. I certainly whatever, um but I'm fine with it. you know Again, um i don't go I don't need a meeting.

01:07:00.47
Bill
right

01:07:00.81
Mike
Thankfully, you know um and that's a good thing in in my eyes. Again, kind of goes back to the you your biker buddy. you know I don't know if this program would work for you, but it's working for me. um Yeah, and know I mean, i go I don't need a meeting. i go I've said it on here plenty of times. I go to be of service. I go to have the hand of AAB there.

01:07:22.78
Mike
um Again, I don't need a meeting and I'm glad I don't need a meeting.

01:07:25.11
Bill
Right.

01:07:28.06
Mike
If I needed a meeting, I'm doing it something fucking wrong.

01:07:28.54
Bill
Right.

01:07:32.59
Mike
um You know, i've I've actually gotten into discussions with some people, friends, who, you know, I mean, I say, look, I didn't get sober to sit in a church basement, and I didn't.

01:07:44.02
Bill
Right.

01:07:44.15
Mike
um Some people do. Some people, that they like it. that's That's their program. That's what's working for them. They enjoy going and sitting in a church basement. I fucking don't.

01:07:54.56
Bill
Right.

01:07:54.74
Mike
um yeah know um I go because, and I do enjoy being of service, but I don't enjoy sitting there. you know My home group this week, man, the lead sucked.

01:08:05.88
Mike
um

01:08:08.80
Mike
You know, it wasn't, it wasn't, you know, I'm sitting there going, fuck, shut up, dude. You're doing it wrong. Um, in my head, of course, you know, but yeah, you know, but whatever, but I was still there, you know, shaking hands and smiling and going, yup, this thing works.

01:08:16.58
Bill
Right.

01:08:25.20
Mike
Cause it does.

01:08:26.50
Bill
Right.

01:08:26.71
Mike
Um, sure so, you know, am I stagnant? Probably. Um, do I care? No.

01:08:34.44
Bill
You know, in the in the I don't even know why I wrote that down because it had nothing to do with, and I'm looking at the, once again, the order that some of these things were were written.

01:08:44.70
Bill
This was several months ago, you know? And I don't even know what why it came up. No idea whatsoever. But um what I wrote in parentheses was when I when i moved to Bannison and I it didn't, I'm like, why the fuck did I write that down and now I know?

01:08:57.03
Mike
Mhm.

01:08:58.87
Bill
So when we were in Cleveland, and and I don't remember, how, with the exception of the Keating Center meetings, you know, we had the Monday and Thursday Keating Center meetings. Those are the ones we had to go to, right?

01:09:09.95
Bill
And then West Park Bens until, or yeah, West Park, right?

01:09:10.10
Mike
Right. Mhm.

01:09:13.86
Bill
Yeah. Until, thankfully, I was working nights, so I didn't have to go anymore.

01:09:18.44
Mike
Right.

01:09:18.59
Bill
um But then you know some of the other meetings we just we were taken to those meetings and we kind of settled into them and like you were asked to go by Don and um I don't know somehow I ended up and so did you and who do you know and all these other ones Stella mares for me was ah that was a choice because of my dad um because my dad got sober there, you know, but I I did the same meetings.

01:09:24.75
Mike
Right.

01:09:31.19
Mike
Right. Sure. Mm hmm. Right.

01:09:38.88
Bill
I remember going to a discussion meeting a couple of times early on, being taken to one, like a big book meeting. um You and I went to, obviously we, you did the 12 and 12, I went to you every once, went with you ever every once in a while.

01:09:51.50
Mike
Sure.

01:09:52.19
Bill
We went to the, um the sobriety store meeting. Remember that one?

01:09:56.41
Mike
No, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:09:57.99
Bill
Yeah, which is a small meeting, but that was nice, you know.

01:09:59.39
Mike
Right, yeah, it was the 12 and 12, right? Yeah, that was, yeah, no, no, it was, that was my first month before Don dragged me to periodist where I've been for the last 14 plus years.

01:10:01.68
Bill
Was it? Okay, I couldn't remember. I couldn't remember.

01:10:10.14
Bill
oh Shit, okay. I couldn't I I didn't remember

01:10:11.14
Mike
Yeah, but it, it, it was a 12 and 12. It was on Sunday night. Yeah. That was, that was my Sunday night meeting when we were, yeah, my first month and then I couldn't go any anymore. Cause I got sucked into service bastards.

01:10:24.19
Bill
Right, and then I was, yeah, I started going to firefighters because my sponsor went there.

01:10:26.83
Mike
Right. Right.

01:10:28.47
Bill
My sponsor Bill and Sapko and I used to go and yeah. But tom so it but it was all all the meetings I went to ultimately were all lead meetings or what people call speaker meetings or share meetings.

01:10:37.23
Mike
Right. Right. Right. Yep.

01:10:40.78
Bill
Somebody's standing up front in front of front of a fucking podium telling their goddamn story.

01:10:45.34
Mike
That's it.

01:10:45.66
Bill
um And when i went to when I moved to Madison, it was literally the opposite. you know They only had, it was once a week on a Friday night, they had a meeting at this one club that I went to, and that's the only meeting throughout the week that had it at these two clubs that were close-ish to where I could get to,

01:11:07.18
Mike
Right.

01:11:07.38
Bill
Then he had a speaker, you know Everything else was discussion meetings and it was completely out of my element to begin with but I remember talking to Joe about it probably you two I'm sure I'm like this has been it's just this complete like um a Revelations wrong word

01:11:09.82
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:11:23.35
Bill
just kind of an eye opener it was a whole new it opened up a whole new part of a whatever program that i was in at the time you know three and a half years sober and rather than sit there listening to people um now i'm talking you know just about every meeting and i'm having a conversation and every it was like it was really weird but i'm like this is kind of fucking cool you know

01:11:26.78
Mike
Sure.

01:11:32.52
Mike
Mm hmm. Right. Right. Yeah.

01:11:44.10
Bill
um And then, you know, I get into, I don't know, over the years kind of a mix of it. So I felt, I guess I didn't realize that I was, like you said, it was just kind of going, not going through emotions in a bad way, but there's nothing wrong with sitting there listening to a story.

01:11:58.81
Bill
But um again, back to this thing that we're doing, I love having this back and forth ah with just you and I, but I also, it's nice having a guest on every once in a while, you know?

01:12:02.21
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

01:12:07.73
Mike
Yeah.

01:12:08.79
Bill
oh speaking of before I forget um yeah William Moyers a long time coming here we first are supposed to have him on back in September and then tentatively in October he's coming up next week so um on Saturday next week the yeah episode next week will be William Moyers he's all confirmed if anything changes now well it is what it fucking is but

01:12:17.92
Mike
yeah

01:12:31.56
Mike
Right.

01:12:32.53
Bill
I we have done everything we can to confirm and make sure before before we started really pushing this again. But um yeah, I think it's going to be.

01:12:38.39
Mike
Yeah.

01:12:41.25
Bill
It'll be a good conversation. I think he's going to be.

01:12:42.34
Mike
o

01:12:43.39
Bill
He's going to be a lot of fun and anyone who um who listens to us on a regular basis. I think I think will enjoy him, but um I'm hoping we'll get get a little bit more of an audience with with him on there too.

01:12:53.55
Bill
But. But yeah, so even even with us I mean it's nice having you and I basically have a discussion meeting every week, with the exception of the time that you know every once in a while we invite somebody into lead the meeting.

01:13:04.51
Mike
Right. Yeah. Well, and and but that turns into a discussion too, because that's what we do here.

01:13:08.35
Bill
Yeah, it does.

01:13:09.33
Mike
So yes, this is right.

01:13:09.81
Bill
Right.

01:13:11.06
Mike
Yeah. I mean, you know, again, you talked about going to my 12 and 12. I mean, I did that for close to five years. I mean, that was, you know, i actually at, uh, at LD's funeral.

01:13:17.57
Bill
right

01:13:22.02
Mike
I mean, I ran into mag, you know, who,

01:13:24.26
Bill
Oh, really?

01:13:24.93
Mike
Yeah. Oh yeah. Well, of course.

01:13:25.58
Bill
Oh, yeah. absolutely Yeah.

01:13:26.68
Mike
Yeah. Right. yeah know and You I've run into him once in a while.

01:13:29.62
Bill
Oh,

01:13:31.03
Mike
Hell, I ran into him at Giant Eagle one night, the local grocery store here.

01:13:33.27
Bill
ah really?

01:13:34.44
Mike
Yeah. You know, every time I see him, when you come in to visit us, you know, i fuck it's Saturdays.

01:13:35.21
Bill
yeah

01:13:39.50
Mike
It's my day off. wow Yeah. One of these days I will. And one of these days I will cause I did love that meeting. It was a big part of my early sobriety. Um, you know, I mean that was, that was studied the 12 and 12 over and over for five years.

01:13:54.87
Mike
So yeah, it was huge.

01:13:54.90
Bill
Right.

01:13:56.07
Mike
Yeah, I loved it, you know, and it was, it was just a great meeting. There was some, Really good solid old sobriety there. It was also right across the street from basically a homeless shelter ah So we got those in there too.

01:14:08.76
Mike
It was a wonderful mix of of all of us in there. I love that meeting.

01:14:12.14
Bill
Right.

01:14:12.90
Mike
Yeah right Afternoon, yeah like 4 4 30 something like that

01:14:13.35
Bill
Yeah. I, you know, and I went, I went with, with you quite a, quite a few times, not certainly not as much as you went, but, um, yeah. And I don't remember cause then I know on Saturdays, I think on Saturday, that was Saturday.

01:14:24.86
Bill
What time four.

01:14:28.77
Bill
Yeah, and a lot of times, I mean, I would go to Stella Maris, which was that was a 630 meeting, I think at that time.

01:14:32.93
Mike
Right.

01:14:34.64
Bill
You know, so a lot of times I would, I don't know, I would be doing whatever I think I do my grocery shopping. Yeah, because I will go down to mom's usually on on Sundays.

01:14:39.17
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

01:14:42.08
Bill
But um I don't know if it it worked out, you know, to go there. And i I did, I liked it. I always, I always got something out of it. And again, the fact that the absolutes were mixed in there was really cool.

01:14:47.87
Mike
Mm hmm. Yep.

01:14:51.85
Bill
um But yeah, like you said, it was a It was a melting pot in the best possible way of people, and it was great.

01:14:55.61
Mike
Mm hmm. Yep.

01:14:59.33
Bill
It was a good meeting. It was a lot of fun.

01:15:00.24
Mike
Yep. Yeah.

01:15:02.59
Bill
All right, so one thing that seasonal affective disorder, because of course,

01:15:12.03
Mike
Sad.

01:15:13.26
Bill
Yeah, sod.

01:15:16.59
Bill
I don't even i didn't even know what to fucking think about this. I never i just i never and never think about it until this time of year, because it comes up every fucking year.

01:15:19.44
Mike
um

01:15:26.14
Bill
And I i did it i copied a piece out of you know the fucking Google machine, and it says, seasonal affective disorder.

01:15:30.99
Mike
the

01:15:34.17
Mike
Yeah.

01:15:34.20
Bill
It is thought that shorter days and less daylight may set off a chemical change in the brain leading to symptoms of depression.

01:15:36.98
Mike
Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

01:15:42.91
Mike
Uh huh.

01:15:43.74
Bill
how do you feel about that mike over to you

01:15:48.28
Bill
i just

01:15:48.85
Mike
I mean, uh, okay. Yeah. If, if you allow it, I suppose. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, thankfully, uh, you know, I work in the daytime and I'm out and whatever, you know, yeah.

01:16:01.25
Mike
I mean, it sucks this time of year. I fucking leave in the dark and I get home in the dark blows ass.

01:16:05.30
Bill
right

01:16:06.18
Mike
Um, but okay. Yeah, it's all about what I do with it.

01:16:10.85
Bill
How do you feel about that, Mike? Over to you.

01:16:11.31
Mike
You know, I enjoy the hours, the hour and a half of daylight that I do get, um, whatever, man. Yeah. Excuses, triggers, yeah you know, fuck, whatever, man.

01:16:21.78
Bill
I know.

01:16:24.45
Mike
If you allow these things to happen to you, well, then you get what you get.

01:16:28.39
Bill
Right.

01:16:29.03
Mike
Yeah.

01:16:30.00
Bill
Yeah, and it just, I, okay, and I'm, I don't know. The people who have to deal with true depression, um I don't, I don't even pretend like I understand it, because I don't.

01:16:37.50
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:16:43.59
Bill
But I also don't understand just because, you know, somebody turned out the light, um and and it's an hour, it's supposed to be,

01:16:43.57
Mike
Right.

01:16:51.33
Bill
What no real time it's supposed to be 9 15 right now and it's 8 15. Okay um Oh I hit by the way side note on that I had the most beautiful thing and I've traveled on the time change Weekend in the fall before it's fucking wonderful man.

01:16:57.29
Mike
Right. Uh-huh.

01:17:08.21
Bill
It was you know, cuz I mean I left I real time, the time zone on Saturday. So I got my hour back coming back here.

01:17:15.94
Mike
Right.

01:17:16.07
Bill
And then the next day I got another hour back. I'm like, I got fucking two hours of my life back, you know, in this weekend, it was fucking wonderful.

01:17:22.62
Mike
Right.

01:17:23.55
Bill
So, and that's happened before because I've been, I know I've been in Cleveland, um you know, during daylight savings time, you know, again, came or end of, you know, and then came back to Wisconsin.

01:17:29.31
Mike
Right. Right.

01:17:32.32
Bill
So, but I just, I don't get it. Like again, when it's, when it's four o'clock and you know, yeah, it starts to get dark and it's five o'clock and it's fucking dark out. no i i don't like it you know but that that goes back to the point of when whatever this shit ends and hopefully when if they stop changing fucking clocks they change it and leave it on daylight savings time so in the summertime that's the point we get these longer days you know it's it's light out till fucking eight thirty or nine o'clock at night

01:17:54.78
Mike
Right. Mm hmm.

01:18:01.66
Bill
um And then it just that we deal with the, you know, the, the spin of the earth and you know the shorter days and it just that that is what it is.

01:18:06.71
Mike
Yeah. Mm hmm.

01:18:09.85
Bill
You know, I mean, we're up where the fuck are you going to live that you're not going to deal it's, it's, it is, it just is.

01:18:15.10
Mike
Yeah. Right. Yeah. I mean, the best you could do is move to the equator and, you know, that's that's it.

01:18:22.64
Bill
Ooh, it's hot.

01:18:24.18
Mike
Yeah, no shit.

01:18:24.43
Bill
i this why this Why is this so goddamn hot? but like yeah I got more daylight, but ooh, it's fucking warm.

01:18:30.80
Mike
Yeah.

01:18:33.82
Bill
Can you imagine you dropping some of these fucking dumb motherfuckers in Alaska when it's dark all day?

01:18:40.12
Mike
Yeah.

01:18:42.40
Bill
Oh, consistent, how many, what is there? A spread of time, and you would know, you' you're the brainiac of the podcast. In Alaska, right, for a certain period of the year, for a certain number of days, it's fucking dark all the time, right?

01:18:51.45
Mike
right

01:18:54.83
Mike
Well, yeah the closer you get to the polls, right, you get, yeah, exactly, very short.

01:18:57.10
Bill
Right.

01:18:59.77
Mike
Yes, yeah, you get a couple of hours.

01:19:00.22
Bill
yeah

01:19:01.84
Mike
I mean, way, way up there. um you know Yeah, I think i think you know in the southern part of Alaska, they probably get, I don't know, five hours a day later or something, you know six maybe.

01:19:15.26
Mike
Yeah, it sucks ass. Right, hi Cameron, how you doing?

01:19:16.99
Bill
This, oh, no, is it? Okay. So I'm thinking of the other way around when it's light for 24 hours of the day. Is that still Alaska is where I don't, I don't know.

01:19:24.91
Mike
Yeah, it's summertime again, the polls, right? Yep.

01:19:31.21
Bill
I just think that, well, it would suck having a dark, but you, could you imagine, I mean, just having 24 hours a day and just, what's the fucking sun's going to go down?

01:19:39.07
Mike
Yeah. Right. Oh yeah.

01:19:40.59
Bill
he

01:19:40.84
Mike
It's like, you know, again, towards the polls, like Finland is way fucking up there.

01:19:43.35
Bill
Right. right

01:19:45.07
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. In the summertime it's, you get like a couple of hours of dark and the rest of the time it's light. Uh-huh.

01:19:53.10
Bill
um I'm part Finnish, maybe I'd be fine there.

01:19:55.37
Mike
Yeah, maybe you would.

01:19:56.68
Bill
Maybe that's why none of this bothers me, because I'm a fuckin' fin.

01:19:59.52
Mike
Yeah.

01:20:01.44
Bill
or Or maybe it should be worse, I don't know what the fuck. I don't get it, because you know the thing of it is, the time change, people complaining about the time change, fuck you if you complain about the time change, because it just it doesn't, have you never traveled?

01:20:10.02
Mike
Uh huh.

01:20:13.49
Bill
like For instance, um I'm just talking about going from, let's say, Indiana to Ohio, or Ohio to Indiana, or I don't know, drive drive a little bit farther to get into mountain time.

01:20:18.65
Mike
Right.

01:20:24.06
Bill
Shit, you can drive, Right now, I could get my car, if I go anywhere between the south to southeast, this whole area, 180 degrees or whatever, or 90 degree area, um through that entire area, I can drive for 45 minutes and it will be, I'll lose an hour, you know?

01:20:27.57
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

01:20:40.84
Mike
Yeah.

01:20:41.71
Bill
i That doesn't depress me. I don't wanna drive for, I wanna drive an hour and a half, you know, round trip just to experience it, but I don't, that just the time change itself doesn't, I don't understand it, I just don't.

01:20:54.26
Mike
Right. I mean, no matter what you get a certain amount of daylight and a certain amount of dark, uh, according to how the earth is spinning around the sun.

01:21:04.15
Bill
Right, that's what I said.

01:21:04.80
Mike
Yeah.

01:21:05.41
Bill
like Unless you do you know don't wanna live on the earth, then you're gonna have to fucking deal with it, so.

01:21:10.78
Mike
Right.

01:21:13.10
Bill
All right, um so i got I got one more here. This is another just, this is, well, I guess that this has something to do with being drunk because it's gonna talk about IHOP.

01:21:20.46
Mike
Okay.

01:21:21.99
Bill
um So, well, in and let me let me get out the first part of it and then that is my question.

01:21:22.19
Mike
okay I've been drunk in an IHOP before.

01:21:29.26
Bill
So um Applebee's and IHOP, apparently they're owned by a company by the name of Dine, D-I-N-E, which I had no fucking idea, again, news story.

01:21:37.02
Mike
Okay. Sure.

01:21:40.12
Bill
Apparently there are different parts of the world right now, like three, four different parts of the world. Applebee's and IHOP, they're putting them in like, like you've seen a Taco Bell and a Pizza Hut or this, that, whatever, like, yeah you know, next to each other type of thing.

01:21:51.50
Mike
Oh, the combining of, right.

01:21:52.95
Bill
Correct. So like literally in the building, Applebee's is on one side. Apparently it's, you could like technically see the other restaurant, I think through like three quarter walls or whatever.

01:22:02.96
Mike
Hmm.

01:22:03.16
Bill
but they got a full fully like all bright and cheery diner IHOP over here and then Applebee's over there.

01:22:07.98
Mike
Okay.

01:22:09.56
Bill
So they're trying to I don't know do any good as a both restaurants I guess is struggling blah blah blah.

01:22:09.96
Mike
Uh huh.

01:22:14.54
Mike
Sure.

01:22:15.40
Bill
So that first of all, I'm like, well, that's kind of weird, but you know, Hey, whatever, whatever works from a business standpoint. Um, but then I, then I thought about it. Two things I thought about, first of all, I wonder how many youngsters out there even know what I have stands for anymore because it's been I have, I think since fuck for 30 years, you know, the people have called it that, but so right anyone who doesn't know Mike, tell them what it says or what it means.

01:22:28.12
Mike
Right.

01:22:32.82
Mike
Yeah, probably. Right.

01:22:37.32
Mike
It's the International House of Pancakes.

01:22:41.26
Bill
Exactly. What does Applebee stand for?

01:22:43.18
Mike
I don't know.

01:22:43.44
Bill
Who fucking knows? It's Applebee's.

01:22:45.88
Mike
All right.

01:22:46.65
Bill
but um So that was number one. It just kind of made me laugh. I'm like, yeah, I hop. That's what everyone calls it. but So next question. When's the last time you were in an I hop?

01:22:53.66
Mike
Mm.

01:22:54.47
Bill
And how many times have you been in one drunk?

01:22:59.07
Mike
yeah Um, the last time I was in an IHOP, uh, Oh shit. You know what? Um, our resident artists, uh, uh, yeah, we went to an IHOP and we actually didn't end up eating there because, um,

01:23:18.48
Mike
because the surface was taking way too long. We ended up going to Dimitri's by my house, but yeah.

01:23:23.14
Bill
Oh, really?

01:23:24.49
Mike
Yeah. So that was the last time I was in an IHOP and I didn't eat. Um, cause there was like two people working in the entire place. It was a post pandemic, but still kind of pandemic-y.

01:23:36.65
Mike
So I don't know a couple of years ago.

01:23:36.75
Bill
Right. ah

01:23:38.45
Mike
Yeah. And there was literally like two people working there and it was going to be like an hour to get breakfast. And we were just like, fuck this shit. Um, So yeah, there's the last time I was in an IHOP, um, uh, drunk, sure. Okay. So as you're talking about this, it reminded me, right? Cause okay. So there's an Applebee's and an IHOP combined, which means that there's now a bar in an IHOP, right?

01:24:04.17
Bill
Oh, I never even thought about that. That's good good thinking there drunk boy.

01:24:08.19
Mike
ah Yeah, that's right. Okay, so um in Sacramento, where I went to high school and lived for quite some time, there was a Denny's out by Sunrise Mall.

01:24:19.06
Mike
Anybody?

01:24:19.21
Bill
Yep.

01:24:19.54
Mike
Yeah, right. Okay, so um there was a Denny's that had a full bar in it.

01:24:25.34
Bill
Oh yeah, yep, there was one in in Waukesha where ah where I lived in Wisconsin.

01:24:26.04
Mike
Yeah.

01:24:31.39
Mike
Oh, okay. So, you know, yeah, right.

01:24:33.63
Bill
Oh yeah, yeah.

01:24:34.32
Mike
It was like, you know, there was the Denny's and then there was a little, there was a full bar with a bar off to the side, but it was part of the restaurant and you could go sit in the bar and drink like you were in a bar and get some pancakes sent to you.

01:24:49.87
Mike
ah

01:24:50.89
Bill
it's It was such a wonderfully horrible idea

01:24:53.95
Mike
Oh yeah, it was fucking brilliant. I loved it in there.

01:24:58.59
Bill
So so we were um me and Pam so this is my my daughter's mom and then we had next door neighbors and when we lived in Wales ah that we were we grew up and one of the guys who was our my buddy Scott then his brother Brian and Brian used to hang out with us every once in a while he was three four years younger than um the Pam and I were or our And I don't know, he obviously loved hanging around Kimmy and stuff like that with us.

01:25:23.65
Bill
And we were all good friends. So I don't remember where we went first, um but he was out with us. um And then we ended up at, I think we went to a bar.

01:25:36.64
Bill
I mean, and then went to Denny's obviously to eat, but then when we went in fucking drinking or ordered drinks or whatever.

01:25:40.74
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:25:43.82
Bill
So we're sitting at Denny's, we got kicked out.

01:25:46.57
Mike
Right, of course.

01:25:47.42
Bill
Yeah, which at that point again all fucking loaded up from the bar um Ended up. Yeah. Yeah, just sitting in a fucking Denny's but yeah, they um I talked about that with people before I didn't realize that you would been I thought maybe maybe we did talk about it on here, but maybe not now um But I've talked to people about that that there was one in Waukesha again not that far from where we used to live and yeah, that's it blows people's minds and like there's a bar and fucking Denny's and

01:25:58.98
Mike
Mm hmm. Now.

01:26:12.23
Mike
a

01:26:13.23
Bill
I'm like, yeah, yep, yeah, yeah.

01:26:14.10
Mike
yeah

01:26:15.81
Bill
And that used to be, I mean, that was a thing because we go to Denny's all all the fucking time.

01:26:17.97
Mike
I mean, it was, it was the one in Sacramento was like a groovy seventies one with like the lava rock on the wall and shit. Oh yeah. It was fucking great.

01:26:26.97
Bill
You know, you know, the funny part is I don't, I remember when, when you'd walk in the door, there was like the, the counter, the counter section a little bit to the right. And you know, so where people could sit at the counter and then a little string of seats to the right, your full restaurant to the left, you know, towards the front of the restaurant.

01:26:36.25
Mike
Right. right

01:26:44.59
Bill
Then if you'd walk straight forward, just a kick over to the right. And that was the bar. I remember like it was yesterday, but I have zero recollection of what it looked like inside the bar.

01:26:57.14
Bill
so that tells me one of two things either it's been a long time or i was loaded by the time we got to denny's and just have no fucking idea but i remember yes sitting at a denny's in a fucking booth probably with a plate of eggs and a seven seven it's fucking classy it's just classy

01:27:03.17
Mike
Yeah.

01:27:12.43
Mike
ah Oh, yeah.

01:27:18.57
Bill
uh but uh yeah so it's just the when i heard that story i'm like it just seemed kind of a weird combination but then it made me think of ah just again you know i mean that's what i hops are for is drunk people but then it made me think of denny so i'm glad you brought that up but the the last time that i think i was in an i hop there was one um because there's a lot of around like college campuses and shit like that i mean why not it's got to be a fucking money maker

01:27:28.77
Mike
Sure.

01:27:41.78
Mike
sure

01:27:41.95
Bill
um But I think that's the last time that I was one there was one down by UWM and same deal I mean we go in there, you know after after fucking bar time just go go grab some food You know, I mean was it was cheap and you know easy enough to get in and out of there at the time We'd have to wait an hour But um yeah, and well you and I went to George Webb George Webb was drunk food and where because you had that you had the chili there and

01:27:52.29
Mike
Yeah. Right.

01:28:04.41
Mike
Great. I believe I did.

01:28:08.61
Bill
I think you did, because I think I recommended that. And it was just funny when I told Dawn that, I think. I don't know if it was that day when you were with me, but I remember telling her afterwards, I'm like, oh yeah. I said, by the way, I said, I went to a George Webb sober.

01:28:19.42
Mike
yeah

01:28:19.49
Bill
She's like, you did, you did what? And I told her story and she's like, she's had to think about it for a second.

01:28:21.11
Mike
he

01:28:24.09
Bill
She's like, oh shit. She's like, I don't think I've ever met a boy sober.

01:28:26.57
Mike
who

01:28:27.29
Bill
And I said, yeah, that's what I told Mike. I'm like, I've never, I've never been in a George Webb before when I haven't been fucking loaded. It's just, it's crazy.

01:28:32.89
Mike
Right.

01:28:35.33
Bill
but um all right so uh whatever man you know what i'm just gonna say it because we showed up tonight we did some goddamn good work tonight well we again we showed up right

01:28:42.91
Mike
Sure.

01:28:47.38
Mike
That's right. We did a thing.

01:28:49.53
Bill
We're not going to sunset our podcast tonight.

01:28:52.30
Mike
Not today. Nope. Not tonight.

01:28:54.81
Bill
And just once again, to repeat ourselves, if we're fucking done with all you out there, we're going to tell you about it.

01:28:59.17
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:28:59.93
Bill
We're going to tell you why.

01:29:00.19
Mike
Absolutely.

01:29:01.33
Bill
We're going to get up there. We're going to give you a piece of our mind before we walk out the door or two.

01:29:05.03
Mike
That's right.

01:29:07.81
Bill
I can see the last episode people listening going, God damn.

01:29:16.35
Bill
Yeah, but anyhow, good. You know what? I think we'll tell them to fuck off like we do now. So why don't you why don't you go ahead, Mike?

01:29:20.25
Mike
All right. Let's do it. All right, kiddies. Thanks for listening to another episode of sober, not mature. So always be kind to each other. Be good to each other. Do something nice for somebody else this week and don't tell anybody you did it Christ fucking be nice to each other. ah Alright, well from the bottom of my heart to the depths of my soul from the beginning of time till the ends of the earth always in eternally fuck you and now it's time for you to

01:29:55.21
Mike
Fuck off. Then keep fucking off. Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying, you cannot fuck off past here. Climb over that gate. Dream the impossible dream and keep fucking off forever.

01:30:12.66
Bill
said that last part with determination. Little bit of grit in there too.

01:30:15.72
Mike
I meant it. That's right.

01:30:18.63
Bill
Yeah, and you know what I was just thinking about? I get if i got fucking nothing to do tomorrow. because I was thinking, I'm like, oh, I get to listen to the the podcast and the car tomorrow, but not just when I'm kind of kicking around, but that's what I do now. i You know, I sit there and i listen to shit in the car.

01:30:29.32
Bill
Oh, real quick, Al Pacino, I started listening to his book because it was, my credit didn't re-up, so I paid for the Pacino book.

01:30:32.43
Mike
Uh huh.

01:30:35.92
Bill
I just got the Alex Van Heelen book with my credit, but

01:30:38.63
Mike
Cool.

01:30:39.25
Bill
um Al Pacino listen to first couple hours. I'm enjoying the shit out of it so far The only thing is I want him to clear his fucking throat.

01:30:43.33
Mike
Hmm.

01:30:47.72
Bill
That's it and That's that's it because

01:30:51.06
Mike
Well, I mean, what, you know, the guys in his eighties, right? I mean, you know,

01:30:54.16
Bill
I know, it's it's really hard to listen to it. You're kind of what I'm going, ugh, ugh.

01:30:59.54
Mike
who are

01:30:59.65
Bill
But he's, and you know, it's funny, you can tell when he's taking a break and come back because the the sound change is just a little bit and his voice is clear, but I mean, he's narrating it.

01:31:10.10
Bill
Yeah, he's he's fucking wonderful. I listen to him on two different podcasts, but yeah, this is just, I'm like, God damn it, dude, clear your throat, come on. Clear it up. But no, it's interesting. Highly recommended so far.

01:31:19.33
Mike
Cool.

01:31:19.59
Bill
I'm two hours into 12. I'll report back more on it later. so But for now, guess what?

01:31:23.95
Mike
go What?

01:31:28.66
Bill
I love you, brother.

01:31:30.20
Mike
I love you too.

01:31:31.86
Bill
All right, I'll talk to you soon, man.

01:31:33.04
Mike
All right. Bye.

01:31:34.72
Bill
Bye.